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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have had a burping problem for a while now and one of the kind folks on the forum has loaned me the airlift vacuum kit. The first time I filled it I think I pulled some air in with the fluid, tonight I made sure the hose was full of coolant with no air before it got sucked in.

Here's the questions:
1. Directions say leave radiator cap off until system is hot. I have not done this on the past attempts. Leave it off or put it on?

2. Do you start with any fluid in the puke tank or leave it empty?

3. This morning during this last try the puke tank overflowed initially then stopped for a while and then puked again when the gauge got to about 180, then stopped again. But, the temp gauge went from 195 to 215 real quick. Was I boiling water or steaming in the air pocket right around the temp sensor? Would this have made the temp rise quickly like this? I shut it down right away and let it cool.

I'm gonna try again in about 30 minutes, I could use some wisdom here...

[ April 21, 2004, 07:24 PM: Message edited by: DavidH ]
 

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No wisdom but here goes:

1. Off; add fluid as stat opens and coolant starts circulating.

2. If you have a properly plumbed tank, start with some coolant in the tank. It won't matter if you run with the cap off but as soon as the cap is on and the system pressurizes, you will start to recover coolant from the tank. If it is empty, you will suck air back into the system.

3. If you flow coolant from the upper rad hose to the tank, the system loses cooling and could overheat (thus the spike from 195 to 215). 215 is not "damagingly" high. Mostly like an air bubble. Let cool, top off and try again.

Hope this helps.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Ok that didn't work.
Ran for all of thirty seconds before the forte fill tank started to overflow.

Could the water pump rotation be backwards?

Can't have that much air in it because when I pulled vacuum twice and it held 24 inches for a minute before I let it pull any fluid back into the tank.

Now what???
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks Joe,
I had read it before several times actually.

Just to let everyone know how the system is plumbed: I am using the Forte fill and overflow tank, the fill tank is the highest point in the system. On the tank I am using a 16 lb cap, it is the only cap in the system. I have the Ron Davis radiator. I am using the stainless flex hose from FFR to connect from the water neck to the fill tank (again the cap is the highest point of the system, I got a 45 deg water neck to keep the hose below the tank) the other side of the tank is connected to the radiator with the stainless hose. The lower hose connects back to the water pump via another ss hose I got from summit (same flexible style as the top hose).
I pulled vacuum on the system using the airlift system and got the required 24 inches and it held indicating no leaks. Pulled the fluid back into the tank. Removed all of the hoses and fill gauge and did not put the cap back on. Ran the motor for 30 seconds and the fill tank started to overflow.

The motor is a Ford Crate Engine 351W.

I have the heater switch in the on postion, but without vacuum to operate the valve I am not sure if the fluid filled the line or just to the valve?
 

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David, I went through 3 new rad caps before I got a good one. I recently totally emptied the system to upgrade some hoses. When I refilled it, I got all but about 1/2 quart of coolant back in through my custom fill neck, and I just poured that excess into the overflow tank. I ran the engine through 1 warmup cycle last night. When the thermostat opened, I got such a rush of air into the overflow tank that the coolant in it bubbled up and actually leaked a little out the overflow. That happened twice, but I only lost a couple of ounces of coolant. I parked it, did NOT open the rad cap, and this morning when i checked all the coolant in the recovery tank had sucked into the engine. I removed the rad cap and the system is 100% full. The trick is not to remove the radiator cap (assuming you have a good one) until the system is 100% cooled off. I think the key is managing the air that inevitably is introduced every time we fill. Once that air is bled off and the system pulls a vacuum under cooling, the recovery tank will do its work.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Well I put the cap on, started her and let her warm up for about 15 minutes to about 180 on the temp gauge. Spit just a little this time, I think mainly due to the fact I may have had too much in the overflow tank to start with (about 1 cup of coolant when I stared it cold - it didn't spit out a cup full when I shut it down and measured it). I'm gonna let it cool overnight and see how much it draws back into the system, hopefully there will still be about an inch or so in the overflow tank in the morning.
Thanks for the advice, I may be sneaking up on this thing yet...
Should I have let it go to 195 where the t-stat opens?
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Another update,
I let everything cool and draw back into the system last night. Tonight I checked the recovery tank and found a slight bit of fluid in the bottom, I figured I would just put about an inch in to the recovery tank, to more or less form a seal. I fired her up and idled for 30 minutes, up to about 180 deg. no puking along the way. I then decided to let her cool and see how much is left in the recovery tank after its cold. I hope I'm out of the woods.

One observation would be that we might be using recovery tanks that do not have enough capacity and that is why when it pukes and then spills out, there is not enough fluid to draw back in without sucking back in air when it runs out of coolant, therefore the next time we start and run it up in temperature it goes through the viscious cycle of spitting up all over again.

I wonder what would happen if on the first run if we connected a full bottle of prestone as the puke tank and see how much coolant was pulled back in after the motor got hot. Hmmmmm...

FWIW, I hope this info helps someone in the future.
 

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I want to make sure that I understand your plumbing. Do you have separate fill and overflow tanks? The way I understand radiator plumbing, and I'm certainly not an expert, you need to have both- or a T filler and overflow tank.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Yes, I have the Mike Forte Fill Tank (Mounted on the F- Panel) and a separate overflow tank mounted vertically on the cross member near the radiator.
 

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I read somwhere where a fellow jacked the front of the car up as high as possible which put the radiator higher than the engine. This put the radiator higher than the engine and he left it this way overnight. He claimed it solved the burping problems. I am going to try it when my car is complete.
Bill Rodman
 
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