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FFCobra Fanatic
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
A little while ago I posted a thread about a problem I'm having with my pass front spring deflecting and rubbing on the coilover adjustment collar. This is that thread. FFR got back to me and said that I should check my springs to make sure the ends are square. I checked today and they are.

I did notice one thing that I wanted to run by the forum. My Bilstiens have the loctited ends so FFR provides slotted spring hats. When I was messing around with the assembly, I noted that the shaft of the shock can move slightly into the slot. Not very much but enough to make the shock no longer centered in the spring. I'm wondering if this may be what's happening? The whole assembly is going to be under a bit of compression when the car is down but as far as I can tell, there's nothing to stop this slight movement other than friction between the top of the hat and the nut/heim joint on the shock.

I'm not sure if this makes sense just describing like this. You would need to hold it in your hand and move it to really see what I mean. I'm thinking that maybe I need to go pick up a couple of washers that have a matching I.D. and O.D. Then slot them and put them between the hat and the shock end only with the slots opposed. This should keep the shock centered in the spring at all times. It will be a pain to cut the washers exactly right, though.

Does anybody have any thoughts? I'll try and get a couple of pics to make this easier to understand.


EDIT: Just discovered that the clip that holds the hat is flush up against the rod in the shock. Looks like it does a pretty good job of holding the shock centered. This blasts a great big hole in my theory...

[ December 23, 2006, 05:17 PM: Message edited by: Wolverine ]
 

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FFCobra Fanatic
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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Here's a couple of bad pics. Note that the movement in these is exaggerated since they're not under any compression. But the movement you see between the first pic and second does happen under compression. Only not nearly as much. But is it enough to cause the spring to rub?


Shock centered in spring hat.





Shock moved to the side.

 

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FFCobra Craftsman
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Doesn't the diameter of "A" fit into the recess of "B" ? Also,isn't the shock installed in the car upside down compared to this picture? That way gravity keeps the whole thing together even if the spring has play when the car is jacked up.
Edit to ad.i forgot to mark it in the pic but about half way down the tapered slope of the hat there appears to be 2 holes.One off center to the right is obvious.The other nearer the center may just be an imperfection but it looks like a hole.Many of these hats have a hole there and another across the hat.They are situated so that a rod about the diameter of a close hanger wire passes thru and is close enough to the shock rod that the hat can not move.The rod/wire is actually like a huge baby diaper pin so you can latch it in place(don't know the official name)
 

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should also have wire ties (chicken bands) on the hat to the spring.
 

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I have bilstiens without the slotted hat.
Used some spacers from Mike Forte diaper pin
and tie wraps to hold the hat to the spring.

I am about to disassemble and inspect everything,
but looks OK so far..

What is with the slotted hat? I don't like
that set up.. perhaps a little heat will
allow locktight to soften so you can remove
the end and put on non slotted hats..

Are the slotted hats a workaround for Bilstien
using lockthight???

Bilstiens don't look rugged enough to me since
there are very few threads to hold on the end.


Dan
 

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Wolverine... I didn't realize in your first post that you had a slotted spring HAT.

http://www.factoryfive.com/table/whatsnew/tech/shocks/updatedprocedure.html

In the referenced: "Shock Inspection Proceedure" page 2, you'll see a non-slotted HAT with a 'special' washer to center the shaft in the HAT. Why not just get these HATS from FFR with the washer? These are what I have. I believe that will solve your problem, also. Good luck. Walt
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Thanks for the replies. I made a mistake and didn't give all the necessary info in my previous post. Long post alert: tank up on coffee before reading...


The pics above are with the coilover completely disassembled. When it was on the car, I did have the diaper pins and tie-wraps. The adjuster ring was correct with the seat toward the spring. The sleeve is also correct so the lock ring catches in the groove.

I put an edit on my first post where I noted that my theory didn't really hold water because when the diaper pins are in, they're flush against shock rod and seem to prevent the movement I was describing. The pins are pretty substantial so I don't think they're bending or anything.

In CraigS's picture, the rod end ("A") is smaller than the recess in the spring hat ("B") so it allows a small amount of movement in there. But as noted, the diaper pin should stop it.

My Bilsteins do not have the jam nut. I think this was how the first batches were delivered. I got mine in Nov, '03. These are the loc-tited shocks. As far as I can tell, there's no way to remove the rod end. The rod is smooth all the way into the rod end. I can get a wrench on the rod end but there's nothing to grab onto on the rod - it just spins. This is why FFR sent slotted hats.

When FFR posted the inspection procedures and all that, they sent me larger, thicker spring hats. The first ones were pretty tiny. One of my original hats has wear in the recess where the rod end sits. You can see where it was wearing away the lip around the recess. Unfortunately, I don't remember which shock this hat came from. I'm almost positive it came from the front. With the problem I'm having now, my guess is that it came from pass front. I'm now thinking that I have a faulty spring that does not compress uniformly. When it compresses, it deflects some. So when I had the small hats mounted on the top, the deflection was causing wear on the hat. Now, with the larger hat on the bottom (FFR new procedures), the deflection is causing wear on the adjuster. It's actually worn a groove on the adjuster. Much more wear than I originally thought.

How likely do you think it is that a spring could be bad and not compress uniformly? But rather deflect a little under compression? And a bigger question - could this be the root cause behind a lot of the shock failures a year ago?

[ December 24, 2006, 12:24 PM: Message edited by: Wolverine ]
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Here's some pics of the shock hats. First two are of the old (small) and new (big). Next two are of the wear on the old hat. I remember when I took that off that I thought to myself, "Good thing they sent me new ones. That old one isn't holding up at all".








 

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I'm thinking that wear on the old hat is from when the hat was on the top,you jacked up the car,the spring fell down,(since it's mounted at an angle and the diaper pin is usually to the outside of the car the hat tends to drop downward but also toward the center of the car),then when you put the car back on the floor it has to pop sideways to get back into place.
I think at this point you should try another spring.I get mine from Summitt most of the time,but in this situation,I'd go w/ Eibach cause I "think" their quality may be a bit higher. Ck here
http://www.eibach.com/cgi-bin/start.exe/eibach/index.html
Merry Christmas
 
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