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Discussion Starter #142
Great post. If I were to do this would you recommend getting a wider pulley to accommodate both cables better?
Thanks! Up to you. If you found one a bit wider that would be OK I guess. But this one works perfectly fine. I'd use it again. Keep in mind in this application with these particular calipers, the cables are barely moving. They are pretty much just going from slack to tight. This pulley serves as a guide, but not much more. I even thought about using a screw eye, but this is a better solution IMO.
 

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Thanks for the info. I've got the Wilwoods from Forte with the integrated ebrake in the drum so might need a little more pull than your FFR Wilwoods. I do like your solution for the cable-routing so I'll probably do some variation that works with my particular setup. Thanks again!
 

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Discussion Starter #144 (Edited)
Instrument Panel Cover and Assembly

While waiting for powder coating to be finished on all my sheet metal and related, decided to tackle the instrument panel. As described in previous updates, I did a slightly modified competition layout using a blank FF panel and fabricated a glove box. I decided early on to give leather covering a try. I picked up a full hide on eBay. It’s way more than I needed, but found a source that was reasonable and figured having extra just in case wasn’t a bad thing. I’m also planning to do the transmission tunnel cover, but that will be sometime later. For my last build, I wanted to avoid the puffy look, so did two layers of vinyl and no padding. It turned out nice, but had a bit less “give” than I expected. So this time around, I decided to give thin padding a try. I bought some 1/8" thick Volara Sculpting Foam from YourAutoTrim.com. I did some testing, and was satisfied. Nice cushion but not puffy.

This is the instrument panel with the foam applied. I used DAP Weldwood Landau Top & Trim HHR (High Heat Resistant) Contact Cement also from YourAutoTrim.com. This is the stuff I’ve used before and it’s outstanding. It’s a professional product that usually is sprayed. But I’ve found it works OK if brushed or rolled. Probably not the most efficient application method, but the smallest you can buy is one gallon, so no problem with running out. If you take something to a professional upholstery or auto trim shop, guarantee this is the stuff they’ll be using.



Some hours later (!), had the leather applied and everything installed. Having done a couple panels in vinyl and now leather, it’s a bit different. It goes from flat to a little wavy when the contact cement is applied. Maybe wouldn’t be as pronounced if the cement were sprayed. But with care it goes down and rolls out nice and flat. It also eats blades. I went through a stack of X-Acto blades. I pulled the leather through to the back with pie cuts on all but a couple openings where there isn't room and there's a sufficient flange or finish washer. The holes were cut taking this into account. These pictures don’t really do the leather justice. The natural grain is pretty cool. I still have work to do on the glovebox. I’m planning to line the interior with leather (have plenty) and then need to cover and hang the door. The grab handle is just bolted through the dash at this point. Once the dash is installed in the chassis, I’ll add braces down to the 2x2 dash tube as I’ve done before.







Just a little more work to do back here.



Quick follow-up to a previous update. I posted my e-brake cable routing going through pulleys instead of under the 4 inch chassis tube. Jeff Kleiner made an excellent observation that perhaps a second pulley with a cable through each might work well. After I got past the “Why didn’t I think of that…” moment, decided to give it a try. It worked OK before, but even better now. I checked as best I could with the transmission frame and mount in place, pictures I have of my other TKO installed, and all indications are I should have enough room. I’ve got the e-brake handle painted and the cable routing really finalized now. It will need to come out one more time to install the aluminum panel and insulation.



 

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Sweet. I like that new cable routing a lot. Thanks!! Dash looks great. I also like the leather but think I'm going to try my hand at using Alcantara. Questions...

Which seat heaters did you go with?
Any chance you have the dash layout drawing handy?
Where did you get that grab handle?
 

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Discussion Starter #146
Sweet. I like that new cable routing a lot. Thanks!! Dash looks great. I also like the leather but think I'm going to try my hand at using Alcantara. Questions...

Which seat heaters did you go with?
Any chance you have the dash layout drawing handy?
Where did you get that grab handle?
Thanks! Alcantara huh? If that's what I think it is, kind of a suede look. I don't know if it was Alcantara or actual suede, but the all girls build FF did on Detroit Muscle a year or two ago had that kind of a dash. I saw it in person at the London Show. It's an interesting look.

Seat heaters are these: Automotive Seat Heaters. Some guys use the waterproof version. I just used the regular ones. I've used them several times. Quality product that works great.

Grab handle is a polished aluminum 275-24P from Grab Handles Smooth Billet Aluminum- 10". I've also used this handle several times. Helps and reminds people to get in/out without leaning on the door or grabbing the windshield. Really helpful for my wife getting and out. She considers it mandatory. Also an interesting barometer when you're driving if people suddenly grab hold of it. I have to admit it hasn't happened too often when I'm driving. Guess I need to up my game.

Sorry, I don't have a drawing of the dash layout. I did post the dimensions of the layout in my last build, which this is based on. Should get you in the ballpark: http://www.ffcars.com/forums/4988081-post52.html
 

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Yeah, Alcantara (Ultrasuede) is a synthetic suede that has been widely used in tons of performance cars (Ferrari, Lamborghini, Aston Martin, Porsche, etc.) for years, usually as a seating fabric to keep you planted during hard cornering. They've recently been using it for dash fabrics to reduce glare (same idea as flocking). My previous Subaru STI seats had it, and my current Chrysler 300C SRT8 even has it. Super soft and luxurious to the touch. Leather looks and feels sweet but I'm in Florida so having leather in a roadster is a recipe for 2nd degree burns. I'm going to try and use Alcantara throughout the interior of my build (seats, dash, doors, shifter, & center console) to cut down on glare and keep things cool. I even picked up a Sparco steering wheel that is wrapped in suede, and had Russ Thompson drill special holes for it in the self-cancelling turn signal setup I got.

Anyway, I appreciate all of the help!!
 

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Hey Edwardb, I had a similar work bench in the basement of our Ontario home when a built a cedar strip kayak. What else do you with a ping pong table after the kids get bored with it.
 

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Leather questions

I did a quick search on ebay looking at various leathers. Can you be specific with regards to what you used on the dash? For example, Lambskin 2-3 Oz Supple Leather Hide Veg Tanned Semi Aniline Skin Black, was listed. What thickness did you use and size? Most say 7 sq feet, is that enough?

Thanks, appreciate the time you take to document your build. You car is going to be amazing!

All the best-
Mick
 

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Discussion Starter #150 (Edited)
Hey Edwardb, I had a similar work bench in the basement of our Ontario home when a built a cedar strip kayak. What else do you with a ping pong table after the kids get bored with it.
That ping pong table saw some epic father-son battles back in the day. But they're gone now -- all grown up -- so it found a second life. My "real" workbench is not seen in the pictures. A pair of Craftsman benches with a single long top, bench vise, etc.

I did a quick search on ebay looking at various leathers. Can you be specific with regards to what you used on the dash? For example, Lambskin 2-3 Oz Supple Leather Hide Veg Tanned Semi Aniline Skin Black, was listed. What thickness did you use and size? Most say 7 sq feet, is that enough?

Thanks, appreciate the time you take to document your build. You car is going to be amazing!

All the best-
Mick
Thanks! I too spent a lot of time looking through various leather options. Mostly on eBay since there are so many offerings. I don't claim to be an expert. This is the first time I've ever bought or tried anything with leather. I ended up with with a full cow hide. It was listed as JET BLACK, 42 to 45 Sq. Ft., Weight: 2.50 - 3.00 oz. per square foot, and specifically recommended by the eBay seller (textile_specialist) for auto or furniture upholstery. It was $160 with free shipping. So even though much more than I needed, I looked at a lot of other options that were less material for similar or more money. So gave it a try. Note I was planning for the dash and glovebox (now done) plus the trans cover. I figured the extra would give me a chance for do-overs, which fortunately wasn't necessary so far. Plus maybe do the door cards, although right now I'm not planning to. In hindsight, I'm glad I got the full hide. Unlike vinyl, natural leather has a lot of variations. Across the full hide, some variations in the texture, some natural patterns, etc. They warn you a hide could have damage (e.g. barb wire), brands, holes, etc., although mine didn't. I did note some slight variations in thickness between the back and down near the legs. Interesting. Wasn't a problem though. Maybe a higher quality product (e.g. more expensive...) would reduce that and be more selective. But I found the extra material allowed me to pick out exactly what I wanted, and avoid some areas that I preferred not to use. I guess I would be a little careful only buying the exact amount required unless they can assure you it's consistent across the whole piece. One other comment. The leather came rolled and then folded into a flat rate shipping box. It had a lot of creases in it when I first rolled it out, and I was concerned that it was damaged or stretched. I sent a message to the seller, and he suggested draping or hanging it across a clothes pole. After some days it was fine. Lots of info and words here, but thought I would share my experience. Good luck.
 

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Discussion Starter #152 (Edited)
Instrument Panel and Glovebox Completed

Today I finally finished the instrument panel. Since the last update the main work was finishing the inside of the glove box, fabricating and covering the door, and installing the hinges and latch. I’m planning to put leather on the trans cover, but later in the build after it’s fitted, shifter location determined, etc. So I’m out of the leather applying business for now. Good. It’s pretty stressful trying to get everything just right because it’s such a prominent part of the final product. But I'm pleased with how everything turned out. I would mostly do everything the same if I did it again.


I lined the interior of the glovebox with leather. Why not. I have plenty. I didn’t trust myself to hit the exact spots with the contact cement, so used clear silicone to glue it in. Same stuff I’m using for sheet metal. Should hold fine, but even though I rolled it like crazy, still doesn’t come out quite as flat as using contact cement. It’s OK for where it is. The doors I made from two pieces of aluminum. I used a .090 inch thick piece for the inside, and a .040 inch thick piece with the same 1/8 inch sculpting foam as the rest of the dash for the outside. I made them basically zero clearance to the opening, taking into account the thickness of the leather. Made getting the hinge alignment pretty critical, but turned out OK. Just a lot of fiddling getting the exact spots. I captured the screws for the door side of the hinges between the two door halves. The final product is a little heavy and in hindsight .040 inch thick material for both halves would have been fine. But it’s not noticeable when opening and closing.



Those hinges are the same ones Alex’s Custom Roadster uses for his glovebox. They’re stock items at Lowes. Just need to pop out the spring closer that comes in them. I mentioned before that I was going to try some different hinges that take up less space on the interior. I tried some suggested ones from McMaster, but the geometry just didn’t work because I have to have the grab handle on the dash for my wife. The McMaster hinges ran the door into the grab handle at about 45 degrees open. These hinges allow it to open to nearly horizontal, and it settles nicely on the grab bar.

The latch isn’t very authentic (but then neither is the glovebox…) but it’s a piece another build thread mentioned and I found on eBay. It’s a VW latch, part number 111 857 131. It makes a really clean installation. Close the door and it latches closed. Push the button and pull the little handle to open. Also comes with keys and is lockable. Took a while to get the right location and size for the catch inside, but works great.


Final shot of the completed dash.


I’m done with this for now. I’ll start doing the wiring when I start that on the chassis. Still waiting for my powder coat panels. I think I’ll get the seat heaters installed into the seats, and get that off the list.
 

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Looks great!
 

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Discussion Starter #154 (Edited)
Heated Seats

Initially I wasn’t going to add this to my build thread because it's pretty routine. But after completing, decided there were a few things worth mentioning. I’ve put heated seats in all of my builds, and we like them very much. I’ve chosen to not install space heaters, and these provide all we need. If a top were ever in our plans, I would have a different opinion. But for us, this has worked well. I’ve used the same WarmSeats WSH heaters from CobraHeat in all cases. Some choose the waterproof version. Either seem fine. The heaters come with pads that need to be installed into the seats plus the wiring harness and switches with indicator lights. Very nice quality product.

Installation of the pads requires some disassembly. Here I had a pleasant surprise. For the other seats I’ve done, this meant removing and reinstalling a bunch of hog rings. Not hard, but a little bit of a pain getting everything stretched back into place and putting the hog rings back in. What I found on these seats is the hog rings have been almost completely replaced with sewn on plastic channels that are hooked over the seat frame. There are still a few hog rings, but none of them need to be removed. Talk about easier. Literally minutes instead of a few hours. I don’t know if this is a general change by the company making these, or maybe only for this leather version. But I'll take it.

The seat cushion has the covering wrapped around to the bottom and glued. Nothing changed there. In order to install the bottom pad, it’s necessary to peel the covering off the cushion and glue back into place. Here I would recommend that guys check their seats even if not installing seat heaters. I don’t know what kind of adhesive was used, but it's not very effective. Kind of gummy and not sticking well. For my two seats, one was about 75% unattached, and the other almost completely unattached. The Velcro at the bottom back was also loose in both cases. Before taking anything apart, mark around the perimeter of the covering with a felt marker, and use this to replace the covering to the same spot. Contact cement works great. I used the same DAP Welwood Landau I used on the instrument panel.

Here's the bottom seat cushion after disassembly, heater pad installed, and glued back together. I cut a slit for the power wire and glued closed.


These are a couple close-ups of the plastic channel that’s hooked to the seat frame. Pop the front one off and the bottom cushion is loose from the seat assembly. Pop the rest loose and the seat back covering is loose enough you can reach in through the bottom and roll the heater pad into place. The hog rings showing here don't need to be removed.



The other thing of done on each of my builds is to put 1/4 x 3/4 inch aluminum spacers on the bottom of the seat frame, seen already in a couple of the pics. This does three things. First raises the seat just slightly, which I like. Second allows the seat to rest a little better on the frame and not on the surrounding upholstery which in some cases is lower than the frame. Especially at the front on these particular seats. Third, and maybe most importantly it provides a channel for the seat heater wires. In this case, I’m bringing the back wire along one side, and also providing an opening for the wire harness bringing the switched power to the seats. It’s possible to route all the wires without the spacers, and most do, but this works well for me. There won't be any pinched or worn wires.


Here's the wire routing from the top. Another tip. Put a piece of tape over the Velcro as shown during the build. You'll be raising and lower that bottom cushion a bunch, and it's nice not having to peal the Velcro open every time.


I hooked the seats up to my 12 volt power supply and took them for a test drive. Both seats checked good. We have burn. They're now done and ready to bolt into the chassis. Last comment. I like the switches up on the dash, as shown in my previous updates. It does take a little rework of the harness, but easy compared to all the other electrical work necessary for the build. Since I’m not using a space heater, I’ll use the heater circuit from the RF fuse box for the seats. The 20 amp circuit is just right.
 

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Discussion Starter #156
Do you trim down the heating elements or glue the heating elements to the foam?

Just curious...

Thanks
Kevin
I should have taken some pics while installing the elements. They can be trimmed in length but not width. The instructions give the details. But for these seats they don't need to be trimmed. Fit perfectly. The seat bottom element wraps around to the front, but that's fine. The elements have self-adhesive strips along the edges. I'm not sure how permanent they are. Maybe just to hold while installing. Once everything is back together and the elements are trapped between the cover and the cushion, they're not going anywhere.
 

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Discussion Starter #157 (Edited)
Panels Installed

Last Friday I picked up most of my powder coated panels and some other miscellaneous parts like hood hinges, battery box, brackets, etc. Total of 53 parts. Several white panels like the already provided white parts from Factory Five, and the balance in the silver/grey Anniversary color. The white matched perfectly because we used the same Prismatic Powders color as the ones from FF. The other chassis color we used a stock color that appeared to be a near exact match based on several samples and small parts. With larger panels now completed, the new powder coat is just slightly darker than the color from FF. When done, most of that color will be on the bottom, so it will be OK. Certainly not enough different to do over, and too late now anyway because most are mounted on the chassis. BTW, the color difference is much less to the eye than what shows in these pictures. For whatever reason, the lighting or flash makes it look different than in does in person. I'll have one more very small batch of powder coating near the end of the build, and that will be it.

I have all the panels installed with several exceptions. Didn’t finalize the DS footbox two top pieces and outside side piece. I’ll do the inside top a little later. The outside top and side will be nearly the last thing before the body goes on for the final time. I also didn’t finalize the rear cockpit wall center and the upper and lower trunk floors. I left the trunk floors off so I can run fuel and brake lines next with better access. The rear cockpit wall will go on after the trunk floors are in. (You all did get the memo on that, right? Don’t install the rear cockpit wall until the upper trunk floor is in. You will find some of the rivets nearly impossible if you don’t.)

I used clear GE Silicone II from the local Home Depot. I used two caulking gun sized tubes to get as far as pictured here. I tried a tube of grey on one of the darker parts, but it was much too light so just did everything with clear. I did apply it pretty liberally so I had good squeeze-out when assembling the pieces (like any good former woodworker would do…) but it cleans up pretty easily. I find Goo Gone Gel Formula works as good as anything. Plain old isopropyl alcohol works OK too.

There was a question before about rivets to match the silver/grey chassis color since there doesn’t seem to be anything available that matches it. Plain silver rivets really stand out. Some guys powder coated a bunch of them, but I didn’t think of that in advance and probably that’s OK since powder coating isn’t exactly cheap to have done. I ended up taking some apart and using the same Rustoleum wheel color I’ve mentioned before. I’m actually quite surprised how well that turned out. I needed about 150 so drilled a bunch of holes in a couple scrap pieces of wood and sprayed them in a couple passes. I kind of felt like I had officially jumped the shark going to this length for the rivets though. One other comment about painted rivets. I used white rivets from McMaster for all the white panels. I found my pneumatic gun is pretty hard on the paint. I tried putting several different kinds of tape on the tip of the gun, but it didn’t help much and wore out very quickly. I found pulling them manually wasn’t as bad, so most of the white I did that way. Surprisingly, the ones I painted held up to the pneumatic gun quite well, although I did end up pulling some of those manually as well. I have to say I like pulling the trigger on the gun better than squeezing the hand riveter. (Feel sorry for me yet?)


One other thing I did based on past experience plus an idea from another build thread. I’m going to use Lizard Skin heat and sound insulation a couple steps from now. The DS footbox outside top and side pieces I'll spray loose and have ready for installation later. The rest of the DS footbox is a real pain to mask and spray because of the pedal box, pedals, etc. So I outlined the areas that would get insulation around the pedal box, masked them off, and brushed on 2 coats each of the Lizard Skin sound and heat insulation material before assembly. Now these areas are done, and masking and spraying will be a bit simpler. I saw someone did this same thing but cut pieces of the stick-on material. Good idea.


Here’s what it looks like now. My kind of different looking two-tone build:








This is a closer view of the filler panel I made for the upper trunk area. Absolutely not necessary, but makes it easier to carpet and looks a little better when done. I didn't powder coat the inner trunk sides. Both sides are buried when done.


This is a closer view of the now nearly completed 2bking sheet metal modification to better fit the Coyote. Turned out well. The good news is that new kits from Factory Five have a similar configuration. I missed it by that much...


Next week I'm going to start on fuel and brake lines. I'll be using rigid SS tubing like my last build. I have the Eastwood flaring tool out and warmed up.
 

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I continue to be amazed at the small, elegant innovations and attention to detail! Great, great job, eb.
 
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