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Discussion Starter #1
Well it looks like I destroyed my cam and distributor gear. They both have to come out and get junked.

The gears didn't just wear funny they were chewed ragged and left a lot of metal in the block immediately around the distributor/cam gear area.

My question is where does all the metal bits fall? Should it fall straight down into the pan? Should I pull the engine and give it a good flush?

When the gear let go we didn't get very far. I just popped and rolled to a dead stop.

thanks in advance. -Jim
 

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what kind of cam did you have (flat tappet vs roller) and what material gear did you use on the dizzy?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
comp cam Hydraulic roller cam, the distributor gear is steel. It works together per comp cams.

I got impatient and created my own binding situation. I just want to make sure I get all the bits of steel out of the engine before I reassemble.
 

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comp cam Hydraulic roller cam, the distributor gear is steel. It works together per comp cams.

I got impatient and created my own binding situation. I just want to make sure I get all the bits of steel out of the engine before I reassemble.
any insight on how the gear got chewed up? i'm almost ready to break in my flat tappet (iron dizzy gear) and this doesn't give me much confidence :)
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I was yelling at the wife to not drop the wrench on my forehead again. As I was putting the oil pump back into place I noticed the oil pump shaft was tight and not moving up and down with any play. Ignored it and the end of the distributor was clearly pushing into the block and cam gear (only after killing it on the road). There should be some play.

Regardless I got pissed at the wife (call it Karma) and its gonna be a long day under the car. cleaning up the shit. Just not sure what to clean other than what I can see. I think I should be good to flush out the bits and just replace the parts.
 

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I was yelling at the wife to not drop the wrench on my forehead again. As I was putting the oil pump back into place I noticed the oil pump shaft was tight and not moving up and down with any play. Ignored it and the end of the distributor was clearly pushing into the block and cam gear (only after killing it on the road). There should be some play.

Regardless I got pissed at the wife (call it Karma) and its gonna be a long day under the car. cleaning up the shit. Just not sure what to clean other than what I can see. I think I should be good to flush out the bits and just replace the parts.
how does having up/down play in the pump shaft affect the distributor gear? doesn't the pump shaft just spin on it's axis, driving the oil pump? or was the pump shaft just too tightly bound, preventing the dizzy to spin once the dizzy was inserted and tighten from above?
 

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Discussion Starter #7
The dizzy was already in from the top. The shaft I tried to install from the bottom and I may have put it in with some tension. the shaft should move up and down slightly. this thing was in tight and I should have calmed down loosened up the pump and give the shaft a twist to see where it was.

Regardless I have been somewhat nervous about the whole dizzy gear and cam so I was gonna drop the HV pump for a regular volume pump, but prior to me getting pissed I looked up into the gear from below and it looked in decent shape.

Now not so much. Want pics? It's like BAD engine porn. Ehh after I get it all broken down I will post up some picks of my bad behavior.
 

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To answer your question, yes the bits would drop into the pan. The cause would most like be the oil pump but having the wrong dizzy gear would contribute. With comp cams in their parts numbers if it ends in a -8 you use a cast gear and a -9 you use a steel gear. You will want to pull the pan and clean it out and change the pump. Stay away from high volume.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Thanks Gordon
 

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The big pieces will be in the pan but it’s the little ones...the ones small enough to make it through the pickup screen and get sent into the bearings...that are the problem. Are you feeling lucky?

Jeff
 

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Billet steel cam=steel gear, all other cams=iron gear. I would not ever trust what the online tech's at Comp tell you, YOU need to know what your cam is, and get the correct gear. I called them looking to buy a steel gear for my distributor, I have a billet steel cam, he insisted I had to have an iron gear, he said no one makes steel camso_O. The tag that was shipped with the cam said "billet steel, you must use a steel gear".
 

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Discussion Starter #12
For Comp Cams 35-522-8 I am being told, by them, to use melonized steel ... Steel was what I had before.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
The big pieces will be in the pan but it’s the little ones...the ones small enough to make it through the pickup screen and get sent into the bearings...that are the problem. Are you feeling lucky?

Jeff
So it goes up the pick up and into the bearings before the filter. I figured the oil cooler and lines had to be flushed for sure.
 

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So it goes up the pick up and into the bearings before the filter. I figured the oil cooler and lines had to be flushed for sure.
No, it goes through the filter first. Use a cast gear.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Thanks Gordon. Gonna dump the oil pump for a normal volume as well.
 

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There is a lot of wisdom in what Jeff shared, it's the little pieces that will lead to future issues. These little flakes have been circulating before you experienced the fatal blow that stopped your engine. If you cut your oil filter apart or check your oil pan you may see little flakes of metal. A few can be normal depending on your engine, but if you see lots of these flakes it would be wise to check your engine out thoroughly while it's apart.
 
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Discussion Starter #17
There is a lot of wisdom in what Jeff shared, it's the little pieces that will lead to future issues. These little flakes have been circulating before you experienced the fatal blow that stopped your engine. If you cut your oil filter apart or check your oil pan you may see little flakes of metal. A few can be normal depending on your engine, but if you see lots of these flakes it would be wise to check your engine out thoroughly while it's apart.
I figured I would have to since I got drop the pan and yank out the cam shaft. this gonna be fun.
 

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IF there was that much pressure on the pump shaft, there is going to be a wear pattern on the inside of the bottom plate of the oil pump and the pump will need to be replaced.
From past experience working on FORD's most of my younger years, if you destroyed a cam gear, a complete engine teardown is recommended. Like mentioned above, your engine is flooded with metal particles that will embed themselves into your bearing material and eventually wipe out the bearings and/or the surface they ride on. It's like running rubbing compound thru your oil lines, it gets everywhere . . . That gear didn't just fail instantly, it's been wearing for quite a bit of time.

Just my 2¢ but I have run HV pumps in all my engines and never had any issues, but I build my own engines, set clearances at the larger specifications (read: loose). Learned this process from a very old school builder back in the early 60's.

Doc
 
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Discussion Starter #19
IF there was that much pressure on the pump shaft, there is going to be a wear pattern on the inside of the bottom plate of the oil pump and the pump will need to be replaced.

Thanks Doc. I'll take a closer look at the cam gear. i will in the middle of changing an oil pan and when I tried to mount the oil pump and shaft, I heard a click when I tightened up the bolts. I looked up from the bottom and the gears look very healthy from what i could see. Shaft was tight. I think I might have cracked off the gearing doing stuff to quickly. Regardless i will take a deeper look into the block and such. If I ever find the time.

Thanks for the advice.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Doc you were absolutely right. I had a chance to take closer look at the cam gear and it is worn with a C shape to it.

Since I will pull pulling the engine for other reasons I will give it a dunk and a flush. Hell I have to paint it anyway.

Replaced the gear and measured the gear to distritbutor flange at 4.031" fully extended. i will check the play of the shaft of the distributor and the oil pump shaft in the block.

Anything else i should check?


IF there was that much pressure on the pump shaft, there is going to be a wear pattern on the inside of the bottom plate of the oil pump and the pump will need to be replaced.
From past experience working on FORD's most of my younger years, if you destroyed a cam gear, a complete engine teardown is recommended. Like mentioned above, your engine is flooded with metal particles that will embed themselves into your bearing material and eventually wipe out the bearings and/or the surface they ride on. It's like running rubbing compound thru your oil lines, it gets everywhere . . . That gear didn't just fail instantly, it's been wearing for quite a bit of time.

Just my 2¢ but I have run HV pumps in all my engines and never had any issues, but I build my own engines, set clearances at the larger specifications (read: loose). Learned this process from a very old school builder back in the early 60's.

Doc
 
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