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Discussion Starter #1
I have been slowly upgrading my roadster with new parts. Out with the old as it were. I have been through quite a bit getting the engine to run without hiccups and have that pretty much under control with carb rebuild, new adj vacuum canister, and timing.
Last year I started having a leak in the original Mustang donor radiator and replaced it with a new 2 core aluminum one. My fan is the large single one. 180 thermostat.
The problem is that I am overheating (what I call overheating) when I start pulling over 2000 in 5th gear. It will go as high as 210 before I slack off to around 1800 cruise.
So do I need the dual fan set up? Is the 2 core vs the original Mustang 1 core the problem?
It purrs so nice at 70-75 cruising, I really need to get this straightened out.
Thanks in advance.
 

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FFCobra Craftsman
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I don't know if a double fan would be better or not. You do have the fan shroud installed correct? Also is all the aluminum in front of the fan installed including one at the top like this?
As a reference my fan is rated at 2000cfm. I am surprised to see that you are having a problem approaching cruise speed. My problem was always in too slow traffic. At anything over maybe 40mph you shouldn't really need a fan.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Yes, I have the shroud but not the Breeze piece. A little history, I had installed the FFR heater, timing cover and water pump gaskets. I added a grooved water pump pulley also.
My running temps have always been around 190-195 before. Strange thing is that I can sit in the driveway at idle for extended periods and not have the temp rise above 200, and the fan cycles and controls the temperature.
 

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Cross Menber
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Have you done anything that could change your timing?
I have seen too much advance cause an engine to overheat.
When the engine RPM comes up the advance comes up.
 

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Is the temp gauge sensor in the same location both pre- and post- mods? Or was it moved to a different port/location?
 

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This statement raised a red flag for me.
I added a grooved water pump pulley also.
Did you have a smooth pulley before and change your belt routing when you installed the new pulley? Your water pump could be the wrong rotation.
 
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Just a random thought, check to make sure your fan is turning in the correct direction.
 
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Discussion Starter #8
Yes, temp gage is same location. The water pump pulley has the same rotation, but I'm going to look at the timing again, I never thought of that. I installed a new vac canister and tuned it till I didn't have bucking at cruise, but maybe that still might be adding too much at cruise vacuum.
 

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FFCobra Craftsman
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Re timing: Assuming your vac advance is connected to a ported source (so no vac advance at idle) setting timing is usually done w/ the vac hose disconnected from the distributer. Most SBFs go for 32-34 max advance w/ 14 or so at idle. At one point I found I had way too much vac advance and I found that it was adjustable w/ an small allen wrench pushed into the hose nipple on the advance can. I set it so I got a max of 10 deg vac advance.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
CraigS, yes I'm pretty sure that this is the culprit. I have been backing off on the vacuum adv one turn at a time. When I initially installed the new canister, I turned the adjustment full CW and backed off 3 full turns. I'm now at about 5 turns back. Ported vacuum? I thought from all the info it should be manifold. If this is wrong I need to change it. I'm going to run with out the vac advance to see it that isolates it.
 

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FFCobra Master Craftsman
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I'm with Norm
If you had a smooth water pump pulley and changed to a grooved water pump pulley normally the belt goes the opposite direction requiring a regular rotation water pump.
 

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I agree with Jeff, you are now turning the pump in the wrong direction. Unless you are running the smooth side of the belt on the grooves, which will destroy the belt fast.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I agree with Jeff, you are now turning the pump in the wrong direction. Unless you are running the smooth side of the belt on the grooves, which will destroy the belt fast.
I believe you folks are talking about a serpentine belt routing. Mine is a very simple crank, water pump alternator set up. The water pump rotation remained the same as before. Here's a couple pics
 

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FFCobra Master Craftsman
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What car did you buy the pump for? That pulley is drilled for both regular rotation and reverse rotation pumps. The inside bolt pattern is for regular water pump. The outside bolt pattern is for reverse rotation pump. Smooth pulleys are reverse rotation (87 - 93 Mustang) One of the correct water pumps for your set up would be 1985 Ford Crown Vic. Generally spinning the water pump the wrong direction causes 10 - 15 degrees higher temp until you put it in a higher RPM. Don't ask how I know this.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
What car did you buy the pump for? That pulley is drilled for both regular rotation and reverse rotation pumps. The inside bolt pattern is for regular water pump. The outside bolt pattern is for reverse rotation pump. Smooth pulleys are reverse rotation (87 - 93 Mustang) One of the correct water pumps for your set up would be 1985 Ford Crown Vic. Generally spinning the water pump the wrong direction causes 10 - 15 degrees higher temp until you put it in a higher RPM. Don't ask how I know this.
uh-oh, when I replaced the leaking water pump I ordered for a '87 mustang gt. So the one that was in it originally was probably the correct rotation. thanks I'll look into it.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
uh-oh, when I replaced the leaking water pump I ordered for a '87 mustang gt. So the one that was in it originally was probably the correct rotation. thanks I'll look into it.
What car did you buy the pump for? That pulley is drilled for both regular rotation and reverse rotation pumps. The inside bolt pattern is for regular water pump. The outside bolt pattern is for reverse rotation pump. Smooth pulleys are reverse rotation (87 - 93 Mustang) One of the correct water pumps for your set up would be 1985 Ford Crown Vic. Generally spinning the water pump the wrong direction causes 10 - 15 degrees higher temp until you put it in a higher RPM. Don't ask how I know this.
Just clarify this, I can still use the belt routing (existing rotation) and the Crown Vic pump will reverse flow.? Kind of confusing, just want to make sure before I take the coolant bath again.
 

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Just clarify this, I can still use the belt routing (existing rotation) and the Crown Vic pump will reverse flow.? Kind of confusing, just want to make sure before I take the coolant bath again.
For clarity, the term you are asking about is standard vs reverse rotation, not flow.

The '85 Crown Vic requires a standard rotation (spins clockwise) water pump. The 87-93 Mustang with a serpentine belt required a reverse rotation (spins counterclockwise) water pump. It has to do with which way the belt wraps around the water pump with respect to the crank shaft. The standard rotation pump spins the same direction as the crank shaft. The reverse rotation spins the opposite direction compared to the crank shaft.
 
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Just for clarity the water pumps for a sbf (and most engines) are centrifugal pumps. The coolant enters at the centre of the impeller and is pushed to the outside. The incorrect rotation pump will not pump the coolant backwards, it will just not pump the coolant forward very well at certain RPMs. In the old days they used to make straight vane pumps that worked with either rotation but not efficiently at all RPMs.
Standard rotation is clockwise and is used on V belts (they were here first) and your type of setup. Serpentine water pump setups can be either rotation but if the water pump pulley is smooth they are reverse rotation.

HTH

Norm
 
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Discussion Starter #20
Hey! The light bulb came on! I don't know how long I would have beat this horse if it wasn't for the help I got here.
Thanks again from this relative newbie to Ford engines.
 
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