Factory Five Racing Forum banner

1 - 17 of 17 Posts

·
Administrator
Joined
·
8,070 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Brought both the Mistress and the Spec Racer out to the first American Autocross event in Sacramento today.

Many have requested a report on how the 3-Link works at Autocross. Soooo here it is...

AWESOME! Maybe too good ;) I actually posted a better time in the Spec Racer with the 3-Link than in the Mistress. (I do have to say I was running on year old Kumhos with many heat cycles and had made some BIG spring changes(too much)in the Mistress)

Back to the 3 link... the car tracked wonderfully. No twitchiness. What impressed me was the steady state cornering. It just hung on like it was on rails. The car turned in perfectly, no push, no tail wagging, and just took a set. The car would power out of the corners without any inside wheel spin like it did before the 3-Link.

Last year I was a good 3 seconds slower in the spec racer than in the Mistress.

Mary took a run in the Spec Racer. The seat is to far back and too low for her. We packed some foam behind her and she gave it a go. She was able to post a time equal to that she had posted in the Mistress after 4 runs. She thought the car felt slow... (it does have 200 less HP :D ) but times dont lie.

So there you go... I think its a pretty good bet you would be happy with it for autocross.

David
 

·
Vendor
Joined
·
8,397 Posts
Sounds great Dave, overall which do you feel handled better? Does it ride as nice as the IRS? What spring did you throw at the Mistress?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,236 Posts
Great to hear, Dave.

I never heard the outcome of that "hot" post about the clearance problem. Did that turn out to be a one-time deal or a poor installation or something FFR corrected?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
121 Posts
Hi Dave,

Good News about the three link.

I'm curious about something I read on the FFR site regarding the 3 link. They recommend welding many of the parts to the frame if your racing a car or autocrossing/racing a street car. It seems to me, judging by the pictures, that it would be secure enough with grade 8 bolts being used to assemble it.
How is yours put togeather?
Do you know why FFR is apprehensive about bolting the assembly?

Big Iron

By the way, Good going Mary
 

·
Senior Member
Joined
·
6,546 Posts
Asked the same question Jim.

I believe he just had a bad bracket.

FFR Fixed his problem, and shipped his part next day or something along those lines.

The Problem with the internet is it doesn't seem like people are prone to posting good news.

Bad news??! FLAME FLAME FLAME FLAME

Good News? Uh..? Ok, I'll look at it..maybe.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,376 Posts
ffr sent me a new designed bracket for my 3-link next day air. i think that they have made one more change after we i ran it a sears point. i believethat david has the older design..i was able to notice a difference between the stock w/coil overs and the 3-link. big test will be next week at button willow. bugs will be work out of the car and hopfully no rain....mike
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
9,772 Posts
Originally posted by Redd Snake:
Bill,

How long have you been waiting for your 3-link?

Has FFR given you an ETA?
I ordered it in November, but they didn't officially record the order until they were in production. I think that was in the middle of Januray. David Smith said he's trying to equip the Spec guys first.

I need mine soon because I'm autocrossing 3 times in the next month.

Bill
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
8,070 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
Thanks guys.

Wayne, I still think the IRS is going to have an edge on the street and Autocross.. and especially on bumpy roads and surfaces.

On the Mistress I went from 700lb fronts and 450 rears to 500 fronts and 650 rears :D .

Last year the car pushed like mad(but was fast) so... now it has too much over steer (no kidding) Think Im gonna change the fronts to 600's and give it another try. Also, the tires are pretty dead so not sure what to think
.

David
 

·
FFCobra Master Craftsman
Joined
·
3,285 Posts
Good on ya, David, I'm so jealous I could just croak!Although I'm not gonna worry about fitting a 3-link on this new one, I thought you'd like to know what an unbiased Grassroots Motorsports editor felt about the 3-link. David Wallens has driven my old car, #1152, at a few autocrosses. He liked it with my stock live axle setup, when I was running FFR control arms up and down, but felt the rear end was skittish. He tried it again after I'd switched over to James Creasy's live axle setup, with Maximum Motorsports lowers, stock uppers, and Koni adjustable shocks, and felt the rear was more controllable and stickable. Then, last week I talked to him and he'd been to South Carolina where FFR allowed him to play on track with a spec racer, which I believe had the 3-link setup. He was careful not to dump on my old car, but was emphatic that the spec racer felt much more controllable and tied down in the rear, not better or worse than #1152, but just more controllable and predictable in the rear. In thinking about his comments later, I believe he was a good barometer of the success of changes to the live axle setup. Anyhow, don't know if that proves anything, but it's an unsolicited thumbs-up for the live axle development of our cars, and the improvement furnished by the 3-link.
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
8,070 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
Mike, I think bolting would probably be fine. I think they recommended welding to be extra strong.

I personally dont think you need to weld in the panhard chassis bracket. Im no expert, but I think its strong enough to just bolt it in.

Wayne, I had the rear bar (3/4) as tight as I could get it. Didnt want to do another bar, so went with springs. I think I need to up the fronts to 600's and it should be good. (I hope) I had a feeling it would be a bit loose, but wanted to test it out. Im also on pretty dead tires. IT DIDN'T PUSH ANYMORE THOUGH :D

John, I appreciate the input. I agree with your friend. Its just more controlable at the limit. That limit might be on the track, or in accident avoidance on the street. The difference comes into play when driving the car at 10-10th's.

I still think the IRS is going to be faster in autocross, and its gonna be better on the street. However, you can get a solid axle car with 3-Link, run no swaybars, 600 front springs and 400 rears... and have a car that just rocks in autocross and roadracing with no tuning or tweeking.

I had so much fun at sears the last race... Hopefully It will be as fun this weekend at Button Willow :D

David
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
73 Posts
I also just went to the first autocross with my home made three link.
After you drive a three link car you won't want to get in a four link car.
With the stock front, and 200# rear spings, my car went from crazy oversteer, to mild understeer. The rear has soo much more grip now I can't belive it.
I now can tell how bad my brake balance is that I can trailbrake without spinning out.
I am going to up the rear spring rate to dial out some of the understeer.

All I can say is get a three link.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
5,303 Posts
the 3 link has no sway bars? thats a big reduction in the effort and complexity.

david, remember your front and rear bar rates on the IRS car work with the spring rates to define the front vs rear bars rates that define the steer characteristics... so you might be on the right track, but need to re-tune the bar rates too.

i think i could use more rear bar (may set it tighter)

-james
 

·
Senior Member
Joined
·
1,033 Posts
I second what David has to report about the three link. I took four runs in the Mistress before I drove the spec racer. The Mistress has a lot more power and she no longer pushes but she still wants to wag her tail out under acceleration out of a corner. The spec racer while limited on power compaired to the Mistress was very predictable on the course. It did not push and had no throttle oversteer. I was able to carry more speed through a corner after I figured out she wasn't going to hang her tail out like the Mistress was doing. I couldn't believe when I looked up and saw my time equaled my best time in the Mistress. I really thought I had gone slower! I think it is the explosive power of the Mistress compaired to the consistency of the spec racer and being able to carry more speed into a corner. I did take my 5th run in the Mistress and take another 2.5 seconds off my best time to get into a low 40 second time. I was just one second off of David.

The three link really does rock!
 
1 - 17 of 17 Posts
Top