EdwardbĚs Gen 3 Type 65 Coyote Coupe #59 Build - Page 5 - FFCars.com : Factory Five Racing Discussion Forum
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post #121 of 294 (permalink) Old 04-12-2018, 12:57 PM
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I just put washers in to fit the hood hinge mounts. Likely you will need to trim the lower edge of the hood to increase the angle the hood opens, it hits on the rad mounts.
also getting the AC lines set up in the foot box is not easy. You found the alignment is tight but the length is also critical. I ended up with one long and one short aff by about 1/4 inch and had to remove the bulkhead bezel to get the fittings to work. If you have to get the hoses built with the lengths within about 1/16 of an inch, don't think that is realistic.
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Gen 3 coupe #16, Dart 363 TKO600 Wilwood's IRS - registered Sept 18 and off to paint.
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post #122 of 294 (permalink) Old 04-15-2018, 03:19 PM Thread Starter
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Instrument Panel and Interior

My plan for the instrument panel and interior is coming together. I’m amazed and incredibly impressed with some of the custom panels and interiors guys have come up with for the Coupe. As I’ve stated a couple times already though, I want to stay with the basic look and layout of the kit. Which is along the lines of the original. But want to clean it up and give it a little bit of a custom/sports car look. Less of a raw race car look. My plan so far is the following:

  • Vinyl on the dash top and front, with 1/8-inch foam padding on the front only. Dash will have all hidden mounts. (Kind of my thing I guess.)
  • Vinyl on the two transmission covers, with 1/8-inch foam padding, both removeable.
  • Vinyl on the gauge panel, mounted behind the dash. Removable also with hidden fasteners. No padding. Will add connectors to the harness as needed so the complete assembly can be taken out of the way to gain access to the wiring behind the dash.
  • Vinyl on the center switch panel below the dash, also no padding.
  • I’m NOT going to use the brow piece.
  • Horn button on the gauge panel, headlight switch and ignition (probably a start button) on the dash, all other switches and controls on the panel below the dash.
  • Russ Thompson column mounted turn signal switch (already received) with the momentary stalk button used for low/high beams and flash to pass. I'll be using an American Autowire electronic headlight module, same as the last two builds. My last one in stock and they aren't made any more. Too bad.
  • Details still TBD, but the switch panel will have heated seats, fog/running lights, hazards, heat and A/C controls, and the wiper/washer switch. I’m not using the FF supplied heat and A/C panel. Instead will install the provided controls in my custom panel.
  • Speedo button and Speedhut dimmer knob on the underside of the dash right below the speedo. What I’ve done on other builds and it works very well.
  • Heat and A/C outlets on the front of the dash corners (not underneath) and two added in the center, in addition to the defrost outlets.
  • Fabricated glovebox, as deep as I can make it and still have room for the wiring and all the ducts that are behind the dash.
  • LED downlights on the underside of the dash corners, on the courtesy lighting circuit (headlight knob twist).
  • Locations for the master disconnect, aux power, and USB power still TBD. Thinking right now the master disconnect will be under the dash but still accessible, and the two power outlets on the ends of the center switch panel. We’ll see.
  • Door cards with pockets. Design TBD. Would also like some kind of door pull. We’ll see about that.
  • Kit provided carpet everywhere else and will have floor mats made. Not aware Factory Five is offering any for this kit.

For the covering material, right now planning to use vinyl. I used leather on #8674 and like it a lot. But that was also driven by the provided leather seats, plus it’s a little more work. For this build, I’m going to also kind of follow the theme of the seats, in this case the Corbeau Sportline Evolution-X seats I selected and have shown earlier. The seats are mostly black vinyl. The usual slightly pebbly variety. I’ll find some material that matches it as closely as possible. Lots of choices there. There are several contrasting panels in a vinyl carbon fiber pattern in the seats. And then the red stitching. Corbeau sells the materials used in their seats by the yard, so I ordered a yard of the carbon fiber material. I couldn’t find anything that looked like a good match anywhere else, and didn’t want to take a chance since the pattern is pretty distinctive. For starters, I’m going to use this carbon fiber like vinyl on the gauge panel, the center switch panel, and accent panels in the door cards. Additionally, I’m going to have the red stitching in the seats duplicated along the top/front edge of the dash, the corners of the transmission covers, and also in the door cards. May looking at putting some of the carbon fiber like vinyl elsewhere (glovebox maybe?) but don’t want to overdue it. Hopefully will give an overall coordinated and similar style look.

So that’s the plan. Subject to change of course (isn’t everything?) but where I’m headed. Last night dove in and made a new panel for the gauges. It’s patterned after the kit supplied piece, but with several changes. Made from .063 thick aluminum (versus .040) so it’s a little more solid, tweaked the tach and speedo locations slightly to give the best sight lines through the steering wheel, adjusted the hole size of the smaller gauges so the adapter ring is on the back versus the front, and will be adjusting the hole size for the steering column so it fits closely around the Russ Thompson turn signal assembly. Right now I just have a slot for the steering column, but will make the final cut matched to the turn signal when I get further along. I’ll be wrapping this in vinyl as described, so the hole sizes are all slightly oversized to allow the vinyl to pull through and be glued on the back side. I used an adjustable circle cutter in my drill press to make the holes. With a little cutting oil, works pretty well. Here’s a picture of the new piece over top of the kit supplied piece. Tentatively also showing locations for LED indicators for the Coyote MIL and fan (I like an indicator showing when it’s running) and the horn button. The turn signal and high beam indicators are built into the GPS speedo. I’m going to rivet a right angle piece along the bottom edge to give a little more stiffness and will also be part of the mounting.


Had a nice 60 degree day last week so #8674 came out of hibernation of its first drive of the season. Other than needing a couple pounds of air in the tires, everything was perfect. Started right up and ran like a champ. Man I like that car. Can’t wait for the real driving season to start. We’re doing an ice storm today. Just crazy.


Build 1: Mk3 #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
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Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017.
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Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017.
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post #123 of 294 (permalink) Old 04-16-2018, 09:22 PM
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That sounds like quite a master plan for the cockpit!

My Gen II panel and cockpit is much more conventional (for me that means "doable"). I have posted a bunch of pictures on my recent posts. I also put the details on my door pull (which is from a Jeep) in a recent post. This is bolted through the upper bar of the door frame so it is quite solid. This may not be fancy enough for what you are envisioning!

I put my master disconnect just aft of the transmission tunnel (just behind the elbow when seated). This is a very visible location but also conveniently between the battery and the starter / everything else.

I am looking to seeing your panel!

Keith
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post #124 of 294 (permalink) Old 04-17-2018, 03:32 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by KB65coupe View Post
That sounds like quite a master plan for the cockpit!

My Gen II panel and cockpit is much more conventional (for me that means "doable"). I have posted a bunch of pictures on my recent posts. I also put the details on my door pull (which is from a Jeep) in a recent post. This is bolted through the upper bar of the door frame so it is quite solid. This may not be fancy enough for what you are envisioning!

I put my master disconnect just aft of the transmission tunnel (just behind the elbow when seated). This is a very visible location but also conveniently between the battery and the starter / everything else.

I am looking to seeing your panel!

Keith
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Thanks for your comments. You're talking "conventional" when you put in a sunroof in your Coupe?

Attaching the door pull to the door frame is good input. Thanks for that. The Gen 3 Coupe has the battery in the front. So I'm expecting the master disconnect to be somewhere in the dash area. Still one of the many details to be worked out.

Build 1: Mk3 #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
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Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017.
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Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017.
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post #125 of 294 (permalink) Old 04-20-2018, 11:20 PM
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Looking good Paul.



You are on the right track with the doors.

You first want to hang the frames and make that work.

Remove the frames.

Then hang the body

Put the frames back on and fit the skins in the body opening.

Then mount to the frames.



John


I wish I had done mine that way. It seems like a much better plan than my methodology turned out to be.

Looking great!
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post #126 of 294 (permalink) Old 04-22-2018, 12:04 AM Thread Starter
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More Instrument Panel

This picture looks pretty similar to pictures I’ve posted before while mocking up the dash. But this has a big difference. This is with my newly fabricated gauge panel, everything placed, and dash mounting determined.


Here’s another view.


And another showing how I was able to get the Russ Thompson turn signal assembly tucked in pretty well.


Now for some details about the work completed to get to this point. First a disclaimer. The stock Factory Five dash setup is fine. It’s well thought out, everything fits, and provides a nice result. I just went at it with a few additional parameters, which I have to say resulted in quite a lot of extra work. It’s not for everyone and for some may not be worth it. Just want to put that out there. None of this is meant to be negative toward Factory Five. Just my own need for punishment I guess.

My first design goal, mentioned before, was to put the gauge panel behind the dash rather than mounted on the front. That actually turned out to be pretty easy. As pictured, at the top the panel slides between the back of the dash and the front of the 3/4-inch dash mounting tube. Then I have three 10-32 nutserts under the bottom edge to hold it in place. It will be pretty easy to drop the fully populated gauge panel out of the dash which gives wide access to the under dash area. Well, sort of easy. It will be necessary to unbolt the steering shaft bearing (reachable) and drop the steering wheel/turn signal assembly out of the way. Also will be necessary to remove the center switch panel that I’ll be adding. But it’s all doable from what I can see so far.

My second design goal, also mentioned before, is to have the dash mounting hidden. The ends were pretty easy. I riveted those in place with flush rivets, which will be hidden under the dash covering. Showed that before. The bigger challenge though was how to attach the dash to the 3/4-inch dash tube that spans from side-to-side. Unlike the Roadster, the dash piece is a large bent panel that includes not only the vertical dash itself but also the horizontal fill panel up to the windshield. This piece rests on the dash tube and the firewall which provides all the structural support. So however it’s attached only needs to keep it from sliding back. I stared at it for quite a while. Kept coming back to using right angle pieces attached to the back of the dash that could be screwed to the dash tube. Same as what I’ve done on Roadster builds. But couldn’t come up with locations that would be accessible to reach from behind to install/remove the screws. Then it hit me. I have four access panels on the dash already! The four heat/A-C vents. That’s way too easy. I ended up attaching three pieces of aluminum 3/4-inch angle stock to the back of the dash. Held in place with 6-32 flat head screws that will be buried under the covering. One at each end right behind the vents. And one in the center between the two vents. They’re spaced to fit tight against the underside of the dash tube. I’ll put nutserts in the dash tube (it’s pretty thin material) and be able to install/remove the screws through the vent holes. Some work needed to reach and remove the vents should it be necessary, but like the gauge panel, is doable. With the access provided with the gauge panel removed, I’m really not expecting to need to remove the dash once it’s installed. That’s my story and I’m sticking to it.

Here are pictures of the back side of the reworked dash with the mounting points plus the newly fabricated gauge panel. As pictured before, I put the end heat/A-C vents in the front of the dash rather than through the bottom as Factory Five shows. They fit, but it’s really tight. Then added the two in the middle. Note the right angle pieces I put around the bottom of the gauge panel. That plus being made out of thicker material (.063) it’s nice and stiff. You can also see the attachment points for the gauge panel along the bottom edge.



Next up is the glovebox. I’m planning to pretty much duplicate the method I used to make the glovebox for #8674. I’ll wrap sheet metal around some wood forms, add an aluminum back, an aluminum ring around the front, and bolt to the back of the dash opening. I’ll do a flush door also like #8674, covered with the same material as the dash. After that, will finalize the removable transmission tunnel covers and the center switch panel. I received the carbon fiber like vinyl covering from Corbeau that matches the panels in the seats. Looks like nice material. Made a couple small test panels and I think it’s going to work well and look good. I’m planning to cover the gauge panel as soon as the rest of the dash fabrication is completed.

Couple other brief updates. Received my “free” shift ball from Tremec. Found a Lokar shifter boot that I liked, and put together with the FF shifter trim ring. For the e-brake, couldn’t find a boot that seemed like it would work, so I asked FF what they used in their prototypes. They said they used the side mounted Roadster one and made it work. Which they included with the Coupe kit. So, found a Lokar trim ring that was the right size, and cut down the FF boot and glued to the bottom of the ring. It’s not perfect, but it's OK. I put 10-32 nutserts in the transmission tunnel cover in the right places and these are ready to install when the time comes.


Finally, similar to previous builds, got out the Fiebing’s leather finishing materials and dyed the door check straps. This is another one of those little touches that makes the car look more finished IMO.


That’s it. I think we finally have warmer weather here to stay. I put gas conditioner in the snow blower and banished it to the back of the garage. I'm done with that. My wife and I went on a nice cruise in #8674 today. Good to be out. Local events are starting up next weekend and into May. Ready to get back at it.

Build 1: Mk3 #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
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Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017.
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Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017.
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post #127 of 294 (permalink) Old 04-22-2018, 01:17 PM
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That's looking very nice, Paul!
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post #128 of 294 (permalink) Old 04-22-2018, 02:29 PM
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Looking good indeed. Iím jealous of your beautiful air conditioning plumbing! (My drysump system pushed that off the plausibility list...).

Your build looks to be very well planned out and executed. Great job!
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post #129 of 294 (permalink) Old 04-22-2018, 08:22 PM
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Paul,

I like the hidden attachment points. Wish Iíd thought of that.

John
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Building when I can, sigh....


Coupe #386,17" Team III 245 FR 315 RR, 3-link, T5, 4 wheel disk, power brakes/steering. Fast EZ EFI
First start Sept. 18 2013
First go kart Sept 19 2013


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post #130 of 294 (permalink) Old 04-27-2018, 04:16 AM Thread Starter
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Glovebox

Busy week so not as much shop time. With warmer weather comes yard work. But did manage to get the glovebox mostly fabricated. I used very similar materials and methods as #8674, the same depth, but a different shape. I made three internal forms out of leftover shelf stock MDF bolted together with spacers between, a back out of .040 aluminum, and a front ring out of .090 aluminum. The sides are galvanized steel duct material from Home Depot. First wrapped the sides around the forms with about a 2-inch lap at the top held for now with JB Weld. Then a bunch of pie cuts and bent over onto the back. Then more pie cuts and bent around the front ring. Right now the back and front ring are also held together at the bends with JB Weld. Once it’s installed, the front ring will be bolted through the dash, and the lap on the top will have bolts from the latch. The back isn't going anywhere. Once it was done, wasn’t too easy to get the forms out. Ended up drilling holes in them and they broke pretty easily.

Then made the cutout in the dash, drilled mounting holes, and temporarily bolted into place. Still need to countersink the screws into the face of the dash. They’ll be buried under the dash covering. The glovebox will be removed while the covering is applied, with the covered wrapped through the opening and glued onto the back of the dash. The interior of the glovebox will also be covered, and that wrapped onto the front lip. Then bolted in placed with a nice finished transition when open. The door will be two pieces of .040 aluminum wrapped with covering and sandwiched together. I’m using the same 173167 Richelieu cabinet hinges from Lowes as #8674, which were also on #7750 from Alex’s Custom Roadster. Their a little chunky, but work very well and have the perfect geometry to lift and drop the zero clearance door out of the opening. I looked at a couple other possibilities but came back to those. Also using the same VW 111857131L pull/lock as #8674. Read about that one on the forum quite some time ago, and it’s also perfect for this application. Available lots of places. This one was $20 shipped from eBay.

Here is the mostly finished glovebox installed in the dash.


In the chassis with a very temporarily mounted door half. When finally fitted and covered, the door will be completely flush with the face of the dash.


Interior checking the operation of the hinges, mounted temporarily with double back tape. As mentioned before, the mounting screws still need to be countersunk. I used maybe more screws than necessary. But once I had the hole cut, took a pretty big divot out of the dash and it was a little floppy. So using enough screws so that the glovebox puts some strength back into it. Feels solid.


This is the VW latch that will be installed in the door. I like it because the latch is spring loaded and is just push to close. To open, press the button and pull. The lock is only needed if you actually want to lock it. Some other latches require the key all the time. This one doesn’t.


I saw this in the shop while making the glovebox, and got a chuckle. I seem to be in the upper range of the “how many clecos does it take” contest. What about a new category? How many clamps does it take? This is gluing the front ring on the glovebox after bending the metal over onto it. The scrap piece of MDF is to make sure it ends up flat. Maybe I got a little carried away.


Most of the remaining work on the glovebox will be when it’s covered and then fitted for final assembly. Next up is the center switch console. With that fabricated, my dash will be nearing completion and ready for covering.

My Gen 3 Coupe update box arrived this week from Factory Five. Contained several updated aluminum panels, one pair of new aluminum panels, and updated hinges for the hatch. The good news is none of the panels that I’ve drilled and fit were included. Which is what I expected based on some advance information. One of the pieces was mounted for shipping. But the rest were from the loose aluminum box. The four pieces are: (1) Replacement front wheel rear lower splash. New pieces are quite different. (2) Replacement upper engine bay splash guards. The ones that are mounted inside the nose. Only minor changes. (3) New pieces, not received before, to mount in the front of the rear wheel well. Covers several openings in that area. (4) Replacement front wheel inside splash panels. These are the ones that were previously mounted. No big deal. In this picture the old piece is still mounted and the new piece below. The main difference is opening up the area where the headers exit. I’ve seen this mentioned in other builds where guys have cut the piece above the opening off. Now it's official I guess.


The revised hatch hinges apparently allow it to open further. I did have the old ones powder coated already. Oh well. Will include the new ones in my next batch. Thanks Factory Five for making continued improvements to the Gen 3 Coupe and supplying the updated parts to those of us who’ve already taken delivery. My understanding is they shipped 60 or so of these update boxes.

Big shoutout to my buddies at the 2018 Huntington Beach Cruise-In this weekend! Some day I’ll have to make it out to that event. I grew up not too far from there. This weekend we have a big Cars and Coffee to kick off the season. This one typically has 1000+ cars and is pretty crazy. Ford Performance is one of the features of this months event. Weather looks cool but so far dry. Looking forward to getting out.


Build 1: Mk3 #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
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Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017.
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Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017.
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Last edited by edwardb; 04-27-2018 at 11:20 AM.
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post #131 of 294 (permalink) Old 04-27-2018, 03:57 PM
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Hi Ed, Great glove box design and fab execution, I'm impressed! Not having seen your roadster build and how you did the glove box earlier could you please explain to me the final assemble again. you mentioned the glove box will be removed to wrap the dash and interior of the box, then bolted together. How do you install the counter sunk glove box screws if the dash is already covered? What did I miss? Do you epoxy the screws in place first thru the dash so you only have to tighten the nuts during the assembly and hope the screws don't turn?

From the photo, the door and the opening look almost line on line, nice cutting! However, is there enough circumferential gap to accommodate both the dash wrap and the door wrap or will you just trim the door size to fit as you go? I'm really enjoying following your build and all of your amazing ideas!
Best regards,
Bob Mac
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post #132 of 294 (permalink) Old 04-27-2018, 04:16 PM Thread Starter
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Hi Ed, Great glove box design and fab execution, I'm impressed! Not having seen your roadster build and how you did the glove box earlier could you please explain to me the final assemble again. you mentioned the glove box will be removed to wrap the dash and interior of the box, then bolted together. How do you install the counter sunk glove box screws if the dash is already covered? What did I miss? Do you epoxy the screws in place first thru the dash so you only have to tighten the nuts during the assembly and hope the screws don't turn?

From the photo, the door and the opening look almost line on line, nice cutting! However, is there enough circumferential gap to accommodate both the dash wrap and the door wrap or will you just trim the door size to fit as you go? I'm really enjoying following your build and all of your amazing ideas!
Best regards,
Bob Mac
Hi Bob. Good questions. Try not to go too far with details, but obviously I left some out since it's not clear what I did. Yes, the glovebox will be removed while coving is applied. I will epoxy the flat head screws into the dash and use some flat-style speed nuts on the back. Good old JB Weld again, which I use as a filler to make sure the head of the screw is completely flat and buried. The speed nuts are thin enough to absorb into the two layers of covering. After covering, will put the glovebox back on and tighten the nuts from the back. I've found screws temporarily mounted like this work OK. But still can be a little fragile until the assembly is completed. Obviously would not be good if they came loose or started to spin under the covering. I install the nuts very carefully and the 6-32 bolt is long enough that I can grab the end of it when tightening everything up. Once assembled, shouldn't need to be taken apart again. Yes, the door pieces will be re-sized to take the covering into account on the dash and the doors themselves. I intentionally made them the exact size of the opening at first to use as a pattern for the cutout.

Don't know how much they help, but here are pictures from the similarly made glovebox on #8674. First is the fabricated box from the front with the tabs bent over and glued to the .090 aluminum ring. Didn't get a similar picture for this build.


Covered and door final installation. Expect the Coupe will be very similar.



Build 1: Mk3 #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
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Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017.
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Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017.
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Last edited by edwardb; 04-27-2018 at 04:28 PM.
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post #133 of 294 (permalink) Old 04-27-2018, 06:07 PM
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Thanks Ed, I should have known better to ask. With the thoughtfulness and precise execution you demonstrate, that some thing as simple as what I asked would have been throughly thought out previously. Sorry to have bothered you, but thanks for your time repeating your methodology.
Bob Mac
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Thanks Ed, I should have known better to ask. With the thoughtfulness and precise execution you demonstrate, that some thing as simple as what I asked would have been throughly thought out previously. Sorry to have bothered you, but thanks for your time repeating your methodology.
Bob Mac
Thanks, but no bother! If my answers sounded like it, I apologize. I enjoy questions. Shows people are reading and trying to understand my ramblings.
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Build 1: Mk3 #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
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Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017.
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Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017.
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post #135 of 294 (permalink) Old 05-02-2018, 07:54 PM
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Ed, thanks for the extra pictures, you do beautiful work! Which of course leads me to 2 more questions. Why did you choose to use galvanize material for the sides of the box and not aluminum, strength vs thickness? What did you use to bond the two haves of the front door together, looks like a real beautiful professional secure sandwiched finished product.
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post #136 of 294 (permalink) Old 05-02-2018, 08:33 PM Thread Starter
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Ed, thanks for the extra pictures, you do beautiful work! Which of course leads me to 2 more questions. Why did you choose to use galvanize material for the sides of the box and not aluminum, strength vs thickness? What did you use to bond the two haves of the front door together, looks like a real beautiful professional secure sandwiched finished product.
thanks, Bob
Thanks! The galvanized sheet duct material bends easily around the wood form giving the shape of the glovebox. But more importantly, bends easily with multiple pie cuts around the back wall and the front mounting ring. The usual .040 aluminum in the kits wouldn't bend nearly so easily for this. Much thinner aluminum, like flashing material, could be a candidate. But it's not quite as stiff or strong. The galvanized duct material works great for this and is just the right strength. I think the piece I bought at Home Depot was around $6, and was more than enough for two pieces. Which I needed because I messed up the first piece. Conveniently not pictured.

The two halves of the door from my Roadster build both have the covering wrapped around onto the back (inside), held with contact cement. When it was time to put the two together, used contact cement where the covering material met, a couple large dollops of JB Weld in the open area, plus the latch assembly provides a mechanical connection between the two sides. Hope that makes sense. Easier to do than to describe. Ends up a solid piece and plenty strong as a glovebox door. Planning the exact method for the Coupe.

Build 1: Mk3 #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
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Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017.
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Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017.
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Last edited by edwardb; 05-02-2018 at 08:38 PM.
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post #137 of 294 (permalink) Old 05-05-2018, 02:39 PM Thread Starter
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Instrument Panel Again

Slow going, but made some good progress I think since the last update. My instrument panel is coming together. First up was to fabricate the center switch panel described previously. It will fit between the bottom of the dash and rest on the front transmission tunnel cover. Made a template from file folder stock (that’s what it’s for, right?) and cut out the aluminum piece.


Then with a little persuasion on the brake plus a little more since it was beyond its capability, had the shape I was looking for. Used .040 5052 aluminum. First because I had some and it’s easy to work with. Plus that front bend might be a little too much for 6061. I didn’t try to bend tabs on the seams where it joins. Just didn’t trust that I could do it accurately enough, plus added more complexity to the bending. I flush riveted corner pieces on each end later to tie it together. Not pictured here.


DriDrilled holes in each end for the USB and auxiliary outlets, and mocked up under the dash. Happy with how it turned out. It will be attached to the tunnel cover and the front edge of the dash. Will hold it in place, plus give some support and solidity to the dash itself. Also in this picture is the new front transmission tunnel cover I made. Once again was faced with whether it was easier to mod the existing part or make new. I chose the latter. I wanted the center transmission cover (the one with the shifter and e-brake) to fit over a tab on the front cover. That way the center piece can be removed without removing the front one since I’m going to have them both removeable. Factory Five has it the opposite, requiring the front cover to be removed before the center cover (not easy with the switch panel and dash resting on it), and IMO should consider changing it. I could have spliced a piece on. But chose to make a whole new one. It was slightly more work but a little cleaner. The front cover will be held at the top with screws (vs. rivets) into the 2x2 frame tube and the tab at the bottom. The center cover will be held with screws through the sides. Just not an easy way to make the screws hidden like on #8674. But it will be OK.


Next moved to covering the gauge cluster panel. Here I’m using the sorta C-F looking vinyl that I got from Corbeau that matches panels in my seats mentioned previously. The material is a nice quality cloth backed vinyl with an added layer of open cell foam and another cloth layer. For this purpose, don’t want the added foam so pulled off the back cloth layer and scraped off the foam. Leaving just the top cloth backed vinyl. I would normally use my standard go-to DAP Weldwood Landau contact cement, but none on hand and not sure how much I’ll really need for this build. Only comes in gallons and isn't cheap. So instead used Weldwood Gel Formula contact cement. Stock item at Lowes. Doesn’t set up as quickly as the Landau, but for this purpose worked fine. After lots of gluing and cutting, got it covered. Put the gauges, lights and switches in and of course first thing had to see what it looked like all lit up. I like it.


The two small LED’s from Watson’s Streetworks are quite a bit brighter than the three LED’s in the Speedhut speedo. The red will be the MIL from the Coyote, so I’m OK if it’s bright. If it’s on, needs to get immediate attention. The amber light is my “fan running” indicator and I’ll tone it down a bit with a resister. Easy to do when things get wired up. Speaking of wiring, just a little bit of work to do on the backside.


Here’s how it looks installed in the dash.


Wider shot showing the newly fabricated center switch panel with my simulated switches. With things finalized, need to get those ordered. The center switch panel will have the same C-F style vinyl. Everything else will be standard pebbled vinyl with some red stitching as described previously.



Still more to do, but it’s getting there. Real happy with how it's turning out so far.

Build 1: Mk3 #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
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Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017.
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Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017.
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Last edited by edwardb; 05-06-2018 at 12:14 AM.
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post #138 of 294 (permalink) Old 05-11-2018, 08:23 PM Thread Starter
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Driveshaft Safety Loop

Bit of a slow week on the build. Have managed to get a few smaller tasks done that were on my list but are neither very noteworthy or photogenic. In addition, spent some time mounting the A/C condenser in front of the radiator. Kind of mixed and matched a little with the parts provided in the kit, but it worked out OK. Decided it was best to have the lower hose stay inside the radiator tunnel rather than the go around the outside like the top hose. Just worked better plus avoided interference with the frame and sheet metal in that area that I mentioned in a previous update. The instructions say to go on whichever side works best. My main accomplishment was getting a driveshaft safety loop installed.

Before that, thought I would share a picture from a car show last Monday. For the last couple of years our club, Great Lakes Cobra Club, has supported a car show at a local high school technical campus. Automotive Technology is one of their programs. They have a shop with multiple lifts, bunch of great equipment, an extensive welding area, and body shop with a mixing booth and beautiful downdraft paint booth. Would be a killer place to work on our builds! Anyway, each year they invite local clubs to bring their cars and interact with the students. The date had to be rescheduled due to rain, but the new date was beautiful and sunny. Probably affected the turnout a bit, but still was good. All of the students, not just the automotive groups, are allowed to come out and check things over. I had good old #8674 there. Along with my usual car show sign, had another that I made for Autorama last year with a number of construction pictures and descriptions. That turned out to be very interesting for the students and led to some good interaction and promoting our hobby with the younger set. Here’s my Roadster between my club buddies Superformance and a brand new Dodge Challenger SRT Hellcat. Obviously before the crowds arrived.


For the driveshaft safety loop, looked at several options and decided to get the rather generic one available at Summit, Jegs, etc. Seems solid enough and best I could tell from catalog dimensions, would fit in the Coupe chassis. So ordered it from Jegs (Summit was out of stock) and just finished the install. Easiest would have been to bolt it on from the bottom. Even though it would have been pretty minimal, just couldn’t bring myself to interrupt that nice smooth chassis bottom or having anything hanging lower than the frame. So mounted it on top. Trimmed it to fit between the cockpit floor sheet metal and installed three heavy duty 5/16-inch rivet nuts on each side. Took a little time because the location for the rivet nuts wasn’t real handy, even with all the panels removed. But it’s done and I’m satisfied it’s very rigid and strong. Hopefully it will never be needed.

Trimmed, new holes drilled, ready for installation.


Installation completed, viewed from the top.


From the bottom.


Also this week took all the aluminum panels off except for the front foot boxes. Just a few pieces left there to fit and drill. Will finish those up when I pull the engine/trans mockup out in the near future. Then everything off to powder coat.


This weekend we’re off for Texas to visit our youngest son and daughter-in-law. So the build will take a week or so off. Enjoying the build a bunch. But a break every once in a while is good too.

Build 1: Mk3 #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
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Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017.
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Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017.
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post #139 of 294 (permalink) Old 05-26-2018, 12:41 AM Thread Starter
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Back At It

As updates goes, this one is especially minor. After a great week+ away visiting family in Texas, back home in (much cooler!) Michigan now. Had some things to do once we got back including hacking through my yard. But last couple of days started back on the Coupe build so will report in.

With all the sheet metal gone, set the gas tank back in place and made up the SS flex lines between the pump hangar and the 3/8-inch rigid SS. Used Aeroquip TFE Racing Hose and Aeroquip FBM1103 -6 AN PTFE Racing Hose Ends. I’ve used these parts several times before and assembly is pretty straightforward. I’ve never tested before installation and haven’t ever had a problem. But decided this time to up my game a little and test them after assembly. Picked up a Fragola Performance Systems 900666 AN hose pressure test kit. Pretty simple setup with a plug for one end, and fitting with a Schrader valve for the other end. With the plugs in place, put in 70 PSI of compressed air (Coyote runs at around 55 PSI) and dunked in water. No bubbles is good. All passed OK. I didn’t quite tighten one test fitting all the way, and sure enough a solid stream of bubbles when dunked. Nice peace of mind knowing they should be good when gas is added.

Just a quick editorial comment. Not real hard to notice I didn’t use any of the kit provided fuel line components. Nothing wrong with them, and many use them just fine. But my choice was to go a little different direction and what I’ve done on the last three builds. What this shows is what happens once you start down the slippery slope of changes. First up is using rigid 3/8 SS for both supply and return (kit is steel 5/16 and 1/4). Then going with the full 3/8 Pro-M pump hangar which has -6 AN fittings. Then going with the larger Trick Flow fuel filter. Pretty soon you’re all in with -AN fittings and SS flex and the rest is history. All the kit parts get left in the boxes. The final result is a very robust and (hopefully) lifetime quality fuel system that should easily handle the Coyote. So far so good with a nearly exact setup on #8674. But much of this is a personal choice, stuff I like to do, and isn’t meant as a negative toward the kit components. Similar comments could be made about my choice to also use rigid SS for the brake lines. Ok, back to the build.

Here are the installed fuel lines, and also now finally routed and anchored the rear harness with a few more padded clamps and 3/16-inch rivets. It’s offset to one side to stay clear of the trunk box shown previously.



Also finalized the routing for the rear harness along the back of the chassis. Plenty of wire on the passenger side. Just enough on the driver’s side. Next step is hook up the lights when the body goes on.


Spent several hours today taking things apart getting ready to remove the mock-up engine block and transmission assembly. Then will finish fitting and drilling the last of the aluminum panels and get everything over to the powder coater. This isn’t much of a picture, but shows how the radiator needs to be out in order for the 2-ton HF hoist to reach far enough into the engine compartment. Also shows the newly installed modified front inner splash guards received in the update package from Factory Five.


Spent some time over the last couple weeks studying the various products available for a keyless pushbutton start setup. Decided to go with the pretty simple Digital Guard Dawg PBS-I. Ordered it direct since I wanted something other than their standard start button. So don’t have it yet. But when I do, will test and do a write-up about it plus some of the other electronic aspects of the build. It’s pretty interesting when you line it all up to see how much technology there is in a 60’s era replica when using modern stuff. More later.

Build 1: Mk3 #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
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Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017.
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Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017.
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Last edited by edwardb; 05-26-2018 at 10:45 AM.
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post #140 of 294 (permalink) Old 05-26-2018, 03:17 PM
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Looking GREAT Paul!

You're going to like the DGD system; it's really slick. Be advised that there is a learning curve for quick restarts (like if you stall in the parking lot or at a red light); you have to lift off the brake momentarily before pushing the button. But once you know the trick & practice a bit it's easy enough.

Cheers,


John
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post #141 of 294 (permalink) Old 06-08-2018, 07:17 PM Thread Starter
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Panel Fitting and Drilling Done

Been a little while since an update. I’ve been working on the build, but enough other life things going on have things slowed a bit. No worries. As of today, now have had all the aluminum panels fitted, drilled, and cleco’d in place. Only remaining panels are the splash guards – two in front and two in back – that will be fitted when the body is installed. I’ll be taking all the drilled and fitted panels to the powder coater next week.

Couple words about the Gen 3 Coupe aluminum panels. I didn’t count them to confirm, but seems like there’s more than on the Roadster. Or maybe I'm just tired of drilling... In general, I would say they all fit very well. I did tweak a few bends for the best fit. Also had to trim a few places to clear welds a little better. But I’m very satisfied with everything. One observation though. Because of the space frame design, and multiple frame and angle pieces, there are a lot of places where the frame tubes go through the aluminum. There are varying sized gaps with most of them that will need to be filled to get the cockpit airtight. Similar to the Roadster, just more of them. I’ll be using a combination of caulking and aluminum tape as I’ve done before. But that’s later. Also, again because of all the frame tubes and angles, be careful laying out where you put rivets. It would be real easy to put some where they're not accessible.

I did make one new panel. In another build thread I saw where the builder suggested a fill panel for the center area below the firewall in the engine compartment. I decided to do the same thing and finished it up this morning. I can’t see any downside to covering that area up. There will be some wiring behind it, so should look a little neater. I am hedging my bets though in case there’s something I’m missing. I drilled holes for the rivets in the new panel, but not in the frame yet. I’ll do that at time of installation, assuming all is OK. I’m tentatively planning to put the Coyote PDB in this area, or on the new panel directly, TBD when the engine is installed. I’ll have the master disconnect behind the panel with the switch lever in the cockpit.


On the passenger side footbox, installed my usual 10-32 nutserts for the access cover to the A/C evaporator and hoses.


These are the rest of the footbox and engine compartment panels now fitted and ready to go out for powder coat. Nothing too earth shattering here.





Yesterday I returned the Coyote block I borrowed for the engine/trans mockup. Now the real waiting begins for the (hopefully) Gen 3 Coyote crate. Also cleaned up the T-56 and hit it with a coat of Duplicolor engine ceramic clear. I’ve done that with my transmissions in the past and really helps to keep them neat and clean. If that’s important to you… Last week I trimmed the QuickTime bell housing and block plate. This to remove the 1-1/2 inches or so of the flange that extended below the frame as pictured in an earlier post. Have to say that bell housing material is tough. But it’s done, nice and straight and touched up. Looks like it came from the factory that way. I’ll post a picture when it’s installed. While all my panels are at the powder coater, planning to dive deeper into all the wiring. Plenty to do there.

I’m going to go off topic now. I’ll try to tread lightly, so bear with me. This is something I want to say. Hopefully it doesn't sound too much like a grumpy old grandpa. Which I am. But just the grandpa part. Most I think are aware there was an accident earlier this week with a Factory Five Roadster that resulted in the extremely unfortunate and untimely death of the driver/owner. Happened here in SE Michigan so is especially close to home. I actually drove through that immediate area running an errand in the DD yesterday. I didn’t know the gentleman, but still hits close to home in our close-knit community. My deepest and sincerest condolences to his family and friends. By all accounts he was an avid builder and supporter of our hobby. Out of respect and not having first hand knowledge, I’m not going to get into the details of what happened. But the press and police are reporting excessive speed as a contributing factor. This is a huge and sobering reminder to all of us to respect these cars for what they are. Properly built and setup, they are a blast to drive and in moderation don't have to be scary or necessarily dangerous. But we have to respect what they are at all times. A momentary lapse and the right combination of circumstances, and, well, this is what can happen. I am admittedly pretty conservative with my mostly street driving. Out of respect for the car, the law, and my own driving ability. But I'll admit I’ve had a few times that I’ve pushed a little where I shouldn’t have, and something happened I didn’t expect almost instantly. Nothing ever really bad or close to losing it. But a reminder of just how quickly things could go badly. I get a little nervous when I see threads talking about "ideal" horsepower, and the numbers go up and up. Many times by first time builders and only for street driving. Yes, the power is controlled by the driver's right foot. But the margin for error gets even smaller at these high HP's. Bottom line, unfortunately many of us act like this can't happen to us. We have to accept that it can. As the LEO said at my first build’s safety inspection, “Be careful out there.” We all need to be constantly reminded and on guard. RIP my brother.
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Build 1: Mk3 #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
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Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017.
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Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017.
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Last edited by edwardb; 06-09-2018 at 02:54 AM.
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post #142 of 294 (permalink) Old 06-09-2018, 12:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edwardb View Post
Been a little while since an update. Iíve been working on the build, but enough other life things going on have things slowed a bit. No worries. As of today, now have had all the aluminum panels fitted, drilled, and clecoíd in place. Only remaining panels are the splash guards Ė two in front and two in back Ė that will be fitted when the body is installed. Iíll be taking all the drilled and fitted panels to the powder coater next week.

Couple words about the Gen 3 Coupe aluminum panels. I didnít count them to confirm, but seems like thereís more than on the Roadster. Or maybe I'm just tired of drilling... In general, I would say they all fit very well. I did tweak a few bends for the best fit. Also had to trim a few places to clear welds a little better. But Iím very satisfied with everything. One observation though. Because of the space frame design, and multiple frame and angle pieces, there are a lot of places where the frame tubes go through the aluminum. There are varying sized gaps with most of them that will need to be filled to get the cockpit airtight. Similar to the Roadster, just more of them. Iíll be using a combination of caulking and aluminum tape as Iíve done before. But thatís later. Also, again because of all the frame tubes and angles, be careful laying out where you put rivets. It would be real easy to put some where they're not accessible.

I did make one new panel. In another build thread I saw where the builder suggested a fill panel for the center area below the firewall in the engine compartment. I decided to do the same thing and finished it up this morning. I canít see any downside to covering that area up. There will be some wiring behind it, so should look a little neater. I am hedging my bets though in case thereís something Iím missing. I drilled holes for the rivets in the new panel, but not in the frame yet. Iíll do that at time of installation, assuming all is OK. Iím tentatively planning to put the Coyote PDB in this area, or on the new panel directly, TBD when the engine is installed. Iíll have the master disconnect behind the panel with the switch lever in the cockpit.


On the passenger side footbox, installed my usual 10-32 nutserts for the access cover to the A/C evaporator and hoses.


These are the rest of the footbox and engine compartment panels now fitted and ready to go out for powder coat. Nothing too earth shattering here.





Yesterday I returned the Coyote block I borrowed for the engine/trans mockup. Now the real waiting begins for the (hopefully) Gen 3 Coyote crate. Also cleaned up the T-56 and hit it with a coat of Duplicolor engine ceramic clear. Iíve done that with my transmissions in the past and really helps to keep them neat and clean. If thatís important to youÖ Last week I trimmed the QuickTime bell housing and block plate. This to remove the 1-1/2 inches or so of the flange that extended below the frame as pictured in an earlier post. Have to say that bell housing material is tough. But itís done, nice and straight and touched up. Looks like it came from the factory that way. Iíll post a picture when itís installed. While all my panels are at the powder coater, planning to dive deeper into all the wiring. Plenty to do there.

Iím going to go off topic now. Iíll try to tread lightly, so bear with me. This is something I want to say. Hopefully it doesn't sound too much like a grumpy old grandpa. Which I am. But just the grandpa part. Most I think are aware there was an accident earlier this week with a Factory Five Roadster that resulted in the extremely unfortunate and untimely death of the driver/owner. Happened here in SE Michigan so is especially close to home. I actually drove through that immediate area running an errand in the DD yesterday. I didnít know the gentleman, but still hits close to home in our close-knit community. My deepest and sincerest condolences to his family and friends. By all accounts he was an avid builder and supporter of our hobby. Out of respect and not having first hand knowledge, Iím not going to get into the details of what happened. But the press and police are reporting excessive speed as a contributing factor. This is a huge and sobering reminder to all of us to respect these cars for what they are. Properly built and setup, they are a blast to drive and in moderation don't have to be scary or necessarily dangerous. But we have to respect what they are at all times. A momentary lapse and the right combination of circumstances, and, well, this is what can happen. I am admittedly pretty conservative with my mostly street driving. Out of respect for the car, the law, and my own driving ability. But I'll admit Iíve had a few times that Iíve pushed a little where I shouldnít have, and something happened I didnít expect almost instantly. Nothing ever really bad or close to losing it. But a reminder of just how quickly things could go badly. I get a little nervous when I see threads talking about "ideal" horsepower, and the numbers go up and up. Many times by first time builders and only for street driving. Yes, the power is controlled by the driver's right foot. But the margin for error gets even smaller at these high HP's. Bottom line, unfortunately many of us act like this can't happen to us. We have to accept that it can. As the LEO said at my first buildís safety inspection, ďBe careful out there.Ē We all need to be constantly reminded and on guard. RIP my brother.
From all members of the Great Lakes Cobra Club, we echo Paul's safety cautions and condolences to the family of the victim in the Cobra crash. Jeff
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post #143 of 294 (permalink) Old 06-11-2018, 02:49 PM Thread Starter
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Electronic Content

As more of the details of this build are coming together, I’m finding it fascinating to note how much modern electronic content it has. Certainly, a far cry from the 50+ years ago these cars started from. Some of it by choice. But some of it just representative of more current automotive practices. I thought it might be interesting to capture some of this in a post. I’ve spent most of my career in and around the automotive industry, and it’s especially interesting, at least for me, to note how I’ve had personal brushes with some of this along the way.

LED Lighting. I already did a post (https://www.ffcars.com/forums/5920353-post55.html) about this, so won’t repeat it. But the build will have all LED lighting, including headlights, fog lights, all the marker lights, interior lights, etc. It’s hard to beat the excellent light output, low current draw, and longevity of LED’s. Other than the higher up front cost, no downside in my opinion. It’s typically necessary to change out the two flashers in the fuse panel for solid state versions, which I'm doing. Other than that, everything else works with the existing wiring, switches, etc. Did most of the same on #8674, and I like it a lot. Invention of LED’s is attributed to a GE scientist in the 60’s. So they’re about the same age as the cars we’re replicating.

Instrument Cluster. Many are using GPS speedo’s these days, and this build is no different. I have the Roadster Speedhut GPS speedo version in #8674, and I’ve been happy with it. GPS is fascinating, from its origins as a U.S. military system in the 80’s, to now used on everything from cell phones to pet trackers and who knows what else. I think most are pretty familiar with it, so won’t go any further other than to say GPS navigation in our cars is a marriage saver for me. But that’s a little off topic. Something else I find personally a little more interesting with this instrument cluster is the technology behind the gauges themselves. For decades, starting with the amp gauge in the original Ford Model T, gauges have been a mixture of coils, gears, bimetal strips, capillary tubes, and I’m sure more. Some of that is still around, but nearly all automotive gauges today are totally electronic with the needles swung by stepper motors. Including these. And a lot of fancy electronic circuits behind sensing whatever needs to be sensed and commanding the needles to move. Stepper motors were invented many years ago, but were one of many advancements from the space program. Apparently, carbon brushes don’t do well in space. Found their way into the emerging computer industry in disk drives, printers, etc. Then found their way into automotive with instrument clusters being just one of the applications. I happened to work for VDO at the time they were making them for Saturn. One of the very early users of all electronic instruments. In its early days, Saturn did a lot of things that were outside “normal” GM practices of the time, and this was one of them. The instrument cluster plant was in Winchester, Virginia, and later moved to Mexico. Spent a lot of time at both. Still a huge supplier to just about every car brand now as part of Continental. If you peel back the instrument panel in a modern car you’ll find the cluster is typically a single circuit board with everything surface mounted including the miniature stepper motors. Pretty cool stuff.


Coyote Crate Engine. Nearly everything on these engines is standard these days. Multi-port EFI, variable cams, PCM control, distributorless ignition (DIS) with electronic cam and crank sensors, O2 sensors, stepper motor throttle body with drive by wire, in-tank fuel pump, and more I’m not thinking of at the moment. I worked at the Philips plant in Indiana where DIS was invented and first manufactured. Wasn’t separate coil-on-plug at the time. But the concept was the same. Was originally introduced on the Buick 3800 V-6 in the 80’s. GM made millions of them, and so did we until the patent ran out. Also made them for Harley Davidson and Outboard Marine. Now DIS is pretty much standard for automotive. Haven’t seen a distributor on a modern engine for a long time. VDO, mentioned earlier, was one of the early pioneers of the in-tank fuel pumps. Still making them today. Spent lots of time at that plant in Mexico. Also worked at plants that made stepper motor throttle bodies, drive by wire pedals, fuel rails and injectors, and the current Gen 2 Coyote PCM. Small world.

Keyless Pushbutton Start. Nothing too earthshaking here, and no personal connections this time. But as mentioned before, decided to do keyless pushbutton start on this build using the PBS-I system from Digital Guard Dawg. They were out of stock when I initially ordered. But did finally receive the system late last week. I very carefully wired it all up on the bench just to confirm it works and exactly like I thought it would. It does. I put a light on each of the outputs (Acc 1, Acc 2, Ignition, and Start), hooked up to a power supply, and put it through its paces. It works like the DD style pushbutton start in our Dodge Durango, with the only exception that the brake has to be pushed to turn the engine off. Most DD’s are automatic transmission, and the pushbutton start won’t turn off unless in park. So for a manual shift car, this makes sense I guess. Installation should be easy enough. This version is just a single module. Other than needing power and a wire to the brake light switch, it wires just like the ignition switch and exactly duplicates the ignition switch function. Should be an easy plug and play including with the Coyote. Popped the cover off the module and took a look. I do stuff like that. Nice clean and well made circuit board. Has three large 60 amp relays. All good.


Headlight Control Module. One of the not so fun parts of these builds, IMO, is getting a DD quality low/high beam headlight setup including flash to pass which is also pretty standard on DD’s. Usually requires a couple relays, one of which has to be a latching type (which I’ve not a good luck with) and somewhat tedious wiring. During my second build (Roadster #7750) a few years ago, American Autowire introduced an electronic module that provided these functions. Really easy to wire and was seamless. I had very good success with it. Others on the forum used it, but a couple had some issues. Turns out users elsewhere were having problems too. American Autowire did some work, released a couple updates, and claimed the issue was interference with analog (not the newer digital versions) of MSD ignition boxes. The problems were apparently never resolved to their satisfaction, so American Autowire took it off the market. Since they worked fine for me, several years ago saw a new one on eBay and grabbed it as a spare. Then had a chance to get another, so got that one too. I put one of them in #8674, and it’s working perfectly. So with one left, will put it in the Coupe. I guess that means I can’t do any more builds since I’m out of headlight control modules.


T-56 Reverse Lockout Module. Found out after buying the 6-speed Tremec T-56 transmission I’m using in the Coupe that it has a solenoid controlled reverse gear lockout. As one who has accidentally made a few grinding sounds with the TKO going towards reverse while moving forward, I like this addition. Doing some research, I found there are several ways this can be dealt with. Some just muscle it into reverse against the solenoid. Others cut the spring in the solenoid to make it push in more easily. Both approaches strongly discouraged by Tremec. Obviously, better to use the solenoid as intended. Some add a pushbutton to power it manually when needed. Others wire a switch to the brake pedal and power it when the brake is pushed down. But the elegant way is with yet another electronic module that senses speed, and when stopped energizes the solenoid so that reverse is available. Once the car is back in motion, reverse is locked out. So I picked up one of those modules, as pictured. Also tested this on the bench with a light and the kit provided speed sensor in a drill. Works as advertised. With the speed sensor stopped, the light goes on, simulating powering the solenoid. Start the drill motor, simulating vehicle movement, and the light switches off. Lockout happening. I like it. I’ll use the built-in speed sensor in the T-56 and the speed sensor wires in the RF harness. But only for the lock-out module since the GPS speedo doesn’t need anything else.


Heater Control Valve. Finally, the heater control valve supplied in the FF Gen 3 Coupe A/C-Heater system also uses a control module and a motor on the valve itself.


OK, back to the build. This week all the sheet metal is going to powder coat. Until it comes back, going to work on wiring including how much of this stuff will be installed.
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Build 1: Mk3 #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
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Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017.
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Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017.
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Last edited by edwardb; 06-11-2018 at 03:43 PM.
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post #144 of 294 (permalink) Old 06-11-2018, 10:26 PM
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Iím interested in the thermotion valve. Mine has the steel wire control to the valve which is a bit of a pain.
How does it hook up to the controls, and what kind of controls came with the kit?

Thanks,

John

Building when I can, sigh....


Coupe #386,17" Team III 245 FR 315 RR, 3-link, T5, 4 wheel disk, power brakes/steering. Fast EZ EFI
First start Sept. 18 2013
First go kart Sept 19 2013


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post #145 of 294 (permalink) Old 06-12-2018, 02:33 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Dol View Post
I’m interested in the thermotion valve. Mine has the steel wire control to the valve which is a bit of a pain.
How does it hook up to the controls, and what kind of controls came with the kit?

Thanks,

John
To be honest, at this stage I don't know too much about that valve. Only what I've learned reading through the instructions. This is my first time ever installing AC and heat. I do know the Coyote requires a bypass heater control valve. Meaning the engine coolant is still flowing through the hoses even with it closed. Just isn't going into the heater core. This valve style accomplishes that.

As far as the controls, what comes with the kit, etc., it's well documented in these instructions: https://www.factoryfive.com/wp-conte...OUPE-Gen-3.pdf. There's a schematic on the last page. Hope that helps answer your questions.
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Build 1: Mk3 #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
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Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017.
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Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017.
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post #146 of 294 (permalink) Old 06-12-2018, 06:00 PM
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Thanks, complete different unit then the Gen 2
I like the electronic controls over the mechanical that I have.

John

Building when I can, sigh....


Coupe #386,17" Team III 245 FR 315 RR, 3-link, T5, 4 wheel disk, power brakes/steering. Fast EZ EFI
First start Sept. 18 2013
First go kart Sept 19 2013


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post #147 of 294 (permalink) Old 06-12-2018, 10:14 PM Thread Starter
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Panels At Powder Coat

Yesterday I removed all the remaining aluminum panels from the chassis. Spent a couple hours getting them all cleaned up and burrs and sharp edges removed. Today dropped them off at the powder coater. All 50 pieces. My main contact wasn't there, so don't have an estimate on the time. Usually it takes a couple weeks. We'll see. I'm doing them in a dark silver/grey satin color. Same thing I used on #8674 that pretty closely matched the glimmer color Factory Five put on the 20th Anniversary chassis. Like the color and like how easy it is to keep clean. Should contrast nicely with the gloss black everywhere else. The chassis looks a little naked now. (Can I say that??) I made a quick temporary brace for the dash that holds it at the same level as the firewall. Planning to work on wiring and the A/C - Heat installation while I'm waiting for the panels to come back. I'm having some custom rocker switches made for the center switch panel I've shown previously. Switches for fog lights, hazards, and A/C. Got the proofs yesterday and they look good. Using only icons. I'll post some pics and more details when I get them.


Build 1: Mk3 #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
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Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017.
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Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017.
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post #148 of 294 (permalink) Old 06-28-2018, 11:44 PM Thread Starter
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Electrical, Body, Coyote Update

It’s been a little while since the last update. 4+ days out of the schedule to attend the London Cobra Show. Pouring rain on Thursday, including flash flood warnings, and a not-too-great weather forecast for the following days seemed to affect the attendance. Haven’t seen any actual numbers. Friday had some spotty rain in the area, but nothing like predicted. We didn’t go on any of the cruises, but nothing was cancelled from what I understand. We hung around and visited friends and took a private cruise. Saturday, the big day, was sunny most of the time with just a couple of really minor sprinkles around midday. The parade into town was a blast as usual. I was asked to be in the Factory Five booth along with some other customers since Dave was there by himself with just one car. Everyone else was at Barrett-Jackson in Connecticut. It was different than previous London shows for me, but I enjoyed meeting and talking to lots of people. Was able to spend some time looking (again) at the Gen 3 Coupe Dave brought. Also checked out Erik Treves' awsome double turbo build. Good old #8674 is the lead picture in the show report Factory Five just posted. Another great time, and I’d encourage everyone to consider attending.

Back to the Coupe build… I’m still waiting for all my panels to be finished at the powder coater. Promised “maybe” for this week and “for sure” next week. I’m guessing it will be next week. Hope so anyway. Meanwhile, decided to start on body work. Following the same process I’ve used with the Roadster builds. I’ll get the body all cleaned up, mounted, everything fitting and gapped, then deliver for paint when it’s time. It’s dirty messy work so really prefer to do it outside on the driveway. First half of the day is cooler and in the shade, so have spent several mornings making dust. Nearly have the main part of the body done, then will work on the nose. Work so far has been to straighten all the edges, get the flanges around the firewall, windshield, doors and hatch straight and parallel. I knocked the top off the parting lines all around just to keep from hurting myself on them. I’ll leave the rest to the pros. In general, I’m pleased with the body so far. I did find a little clay in places in the parting lines, so dug that out. There’s a couple spots that need some HSRF repair, but nothing major at all. The areas around the side quarter windows will need the most work. Obviously I’ll learn a lot more when it’s time to start fitting everything to the chassis. Hope to finish this stage with a couple more morning sessions.


Before we left for London, I did start tearing into the wiring. First order of business was the Ron Francis main harness. With the fuse panel in place, started looking at what it was going to take to get everything routed the way I wanted. Didn’t take long and I had the wrapping off quite a bit of it. Removed the Hot Rod specific harness branch and a couple other unused wires. Then change the routing and angles so the front harness and brake pedals wires are properly oriented. With that progress, stopped and did a spreadsheet plan for all the circuits and how I’m planning to connect everything. Also mocked up the hoses for the HVAC connections so I could see what space I have to work with. It’s going to be tight, but I think it’s going to fit. But I’ve decided I’m not going to go any further until I have the Coyote harness. Somehow that all needs to fit and be integrated as well. So I’ve stopped for now. Snapped this pic. This is definitely the “before” picture with everything just stuffed in there. It will look a lot different when done.


This week I received the three custom switches for the switch panel. Talked about before. They’re rocker switches for the fog lights, hazards, and A/C on/off. They have laser etched icons, and LED indicators. I’ll have the LED’s under the icons on the dash lighting circuit. The other LED’s light when pushed on. The literature says they’re rated for 15 amps at 12 volts. But they’re marked 20 amps at 12 volts. Either way, will easily handle the three circuits without relays. These are from New Vintage USA, a local company here in SE Michigan. They have a lot of interesting products and from this small job do very nice work. Not cheap (there’s a common theme…) but I’m happy with them. I’ve now got the switch panel basically done. A few more details and it will get the same C-F style vinyl wrap as the gauge panel. In addition to the switches already mentioned are the temp and fan control for HVAC, wiper/washer switch, seat heater switches, and aux outlets on the ends. Note that this is integrating the FF supplied HVAC controls. So I won’t be using their panel.


I’ve also managed to get some updates about the Gen 3 Coyote crate. Looks like it’s going to happen! I have several sources, and not sure I should be posting too much. But seems the release and availability is maybe 1-2 months away. The part numbers for the engine and control pack (manual shift only) have been released along with the pricing. It is more than the Gen 2. Won’t know exactly how much since street price is less than retail. But pretty much what I expected. Could have been worse I guess. I’ve got feelers out to see if I can be first in line or on a waiting list when they’re released. We’ll see how that goes. But I’m now nearly positive this is going to work for my build and the timing is going to be OK. There are now multiple reviews of the Gen 3 (2018) Coyote out there, with impressive results. Pretty stoked about it.

Finally, all good builds have to have new and more tools, right? So here’s another. Pretty common these days to have torque-to-yield bolts with both torque and angle specifications for tightening. I’ve always determined the angles as best I could. But with more of these coming on the build, decided it was time to have an angle gauge. Looked at several options, and decided on this Brown Line Metalworks BLDAG001 unit. My digital torque wrench is from Brown Line, and I’ve been happy with the quality. This unit has magnets that attach to the handle of whatever wrench you’re using. Reads the angle, warns when you’re approaching the selected angle, etc. Just played with it so far. No actual real use. But certainly a big step up from my previous guesstimating.


That’s it for now.

Build 1: Mk3 #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
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Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017.
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Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017.
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Last edited by edwardb; 06-29-2018 at 12:20 AM.
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post #149 of 294 (permalink) Old 07-02-2018, 10:14 PM Thread Starter
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Powder Coat Panels

Today I received word my powder coated panels were done and picked them up. All 50 pieces. Turned out nice. I'm real happy with the color. They call it IG 90 Satin Glimmer. Don't know the brand. But it's a close match to the frame on the #8674 Anniversary Roadster, and used it some on that build as well. I think it's a nice compliment to the gloss black frame on the Coupe. My experience is that it's easy to keep clean and the satin doesn't show scratches. This isn't much of a picture, but was setting most of them in place as I was making sure I had everything. I did.


Going to wrap up what I'm working on with electrical and then switch over to panel insulation and installation. Still undecided how I'm going to do the heat and sound insulation. I really want to use Lizard Skin like I've done before. But with several panels that don't go on until after the body is on, plus all the various frame pieces and angles in the footboxes, not sure. Would be a real pain to mask and spray. Thinking of masking the footbox pieces loose, spraying, and then installing. That might be much easier and work just as well. Or maybe switch to a stick on product for the footwells and spray Lizard Skin on the rest. Have to think about this some more.

Build 1: Mk3 #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
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Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017.
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Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017.
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post #150 of 294 (permalink) Old 07-06-2018, 07:51 PM Thread Starter
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More Electrical

Another quick update. Today finished the center switch panel. Wrapped it with the same C-F like vinyl used on my gauge panel. A little tedious, but it’s done and turned out nice I think. Also worked more on the overall layout of all the electrical components. I mounted the previously discussed modules across the top of the upper transmission tunnel cover. They’re pretty much out of the way of the main wiring harness and HVAC ducts. Plus hidden by the switch panel. So I think (hope) it’s all going to fit and be reasonably accessible if needed. This is the completed switch panel with everything mounted. Managed to sink quite a few hours into this with the design and fabrication. Lots going on, even though doesn't quite look like it now. One last minute surprise. Had to make a cutout in the switch panel base and trans cover for a corner of the Cole Hersee wiper/washer switch. It's pretty big. Then made a little sheet metal cover for the underside to seal it up. Always something.


Left to right – relays for the headlight reminder and fog lights, headlight control module, keyless push button start module, reverse lock-out module. Have to get everything hooked up, but this is a start.

Here’s the gauge cluster and switch panel in my now nearly completed dash. Lots of work to do obviously for all those wires hanging into the footbox. As mentioned before, planning vinyl on the front and top of the dash, with red stitching that matches my seats across the top front. No brow piece. The two trans covers will also be vinyl covered, with red stitching along the corners. The glove box door will probably be the same vinyl as the dash. I'll look at using the C-F style vinyl, although that might be too much. But coming together now.


The switch panel is held in place with six screws through the bottom of the trans cover, all accessible from underneath, and two into the underside of the dash. With those screws removed, the panel will slide out. The gauge cluster is captured between the dash and the upper dash tube at the top and three screws along the bottom. With the switch panel and those three screws removed, it will tip out. At that point, all the wiring should be accessible, including the modules pictured previously. Both the upper and lower trans covers also will be removable. None of that would be real quick but possible. Hopefully won’t be necessary.

That’s a good head start on electrical. Basically fabrication is completed and ready for wiring. But going to take all this out and get going on permanently mounting panels and getting everything insulated. Then wiring can be finalized.

Family visits and other stuff going on for the next couple weeks, so progress will be slowed a little. That’s OK. With the warmer weather it’s been a little warm in the garage. Received another update on the Gen 3 Coyote. Saying “end of August” is looking pretty good. That works.

Build 1: Mk3 #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
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Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017.
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Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017.
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