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Edwardb�s Gen 3 Type 65 Coyote Coupe #59 Build

165K views 376 replies 54 participants last post by  Fat Larry”s Garage 
#1 ·
Edwardb’s Gen 3 Type 65 Coyote Coupe #59 Build

Time to start another build! This will be my fourth FF build, and the first one that doesn't look like a Roadster. I’ve always had my eye on the Type 65 Coupe. When Factory Five announced the Gen 3 Coupe, I started considering it more seriously. I saw it in person for the first time at the 2017 Open House in Wareham. Then again at the 2017 London Cobra Show. I like what they've done with it, and am excited to start this all over again. I really enjoy the build process and this looks like an interesting challenge. This will be a 99% street cruiser. Of course performance is important. But also want it to be streetable and relatively comfortable. With a top and HVAC, maybe some added comfort compared to the Roadster. Still a fair weather car though and will spend Michigan winters in hibernation. I'm planning to take my time with the build. Probably in the 2 year range. The 20th Anniversary Roadster isn't going anywhere though! It's staying right here. So, something to build and something to drive. Doesn’t get better than that.

I had the first week of September circled on my calendar as the right time to order my Coupe. That fit with some other stuff going on including getting my garage and workshop rehab completed. When the time came, thank you Factory Five for announcing the first sale on the Gen 3 Coupe! I placed my order and received a November 18 completion date. I ordered the following:

Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe Complete Kit
Gloss black powder coated chassis
Body cutouts and Nose Scoops
GPS Gauge Set
31 Spline Coyote T-56 Magnum w/IRS driveshaft
5.0L Coyote Install Kit
Vinyl Roadster Seats. Will replace with high backs. TBD
2015+ Mustang based IRS
Double Adjustable Koni shocks
Black Carpet Package
Leather Steering Wheel
Front and rear swaybar
18-inch wheels (free with Fall Sale!!)
Wilwood 12.88-inch brakes front and rear, black calipers
Stewart Delivery

This is the first time I haven't picked up my kit in person. Not sure how well it would fit into my 14-foot SE plus I really don't need the long drive and mess around with sales tax which wasn't the case before. I'm still working on the details of the actual build plan. Lots of TBD's that I'll decide about as I go and start mocking things up, plus watch and learn from other builds.

Like my Anniversary Roadster build, this will be a Coyote build. Just can’t say enough good things about that engine in these cars. The Roadster is just awesome with the Gen 2 Coyote it has. With the 2018 Mustang, now in production, Ford introduced the Gen 3 Coyote. More power (of course!) and some interesting new features. Somehow Gen 3 Coupe and Gen 3 Coyote has a nice ring to it and I enjoy trying new stuff. Ford is saying they will have a crate version of the Gen 3 Coyote “sometime” in 2018. I will stay on top of it and hopefully that will work out.

I've also decided to go with a T56 Magnum to get 6 speeds plus supposedly it shifts nice. The price is only slightly more than the Liberty modified TKO's I've used on my last two builds. A little bit bigger and heavier, but looks like it fits into the Gen 3 Coupe OK.

The IRS, sway bars, shocks and brakes are all the same as on my current 20th Anniversary Roadster. Everything about that car is absolutely perfect, so I'm not changing anything there. I'll be doing heat and A/C for the first time. Still looking at options for the PS and A/C pumps on the Coyote. There are several. I'm not going to go crazy, but I want the interior to be nicely finished and detailed. Carpet, headliner, nice dash, etc. I'm going to decide about seats later as well. We'll see how that all works out.

I'm also pretty certain I'm going to try a hydraulic throw-out bearing setup. I've done a hydraulic clutch on my last two Roadster builds, and love how well it works. Plus with the Wilwood pedal box it's easy at that end. But I'm leaning towards not doing the external slave and instead doing an internal hydraulic TOB. That's what the newer Mustangs use. I've heard nothing but good things about the Tilton 6000 TOB, so that's what I'm considering. Yes, it's risky because of major tear-down in case of issues. We'll see.

So, these are the details of my build plan so far:

2018+ Gen 3 Coyote Crate Engine and Controls Pack
4 into 4 straight tube headers (TBD)
QuickTime bell housing (only option with the T56)
Ford Racing billet steel flywheel
Ford Racing / Centerforce dual friction clutch
Tilton 6000 hydraulic throw-out bearing
Tremec Magnum T-56 6-speed transmission (2.66, 1.78, 1.30, 1.00, .80, .63)
3.73 Torsen 2015+ IRS center section. Interested to try the Torsen version, plus the 3.73 ratio matches up with the T56 perfectly
Heater, defroster, and A/C (details TBD)
Heated seats if possible (orders from the boss)
Hydraulic power steering (likely Breeze rack and KRC pump)
Manual brakes (kit supplied Wilwood pedal box)
Full aluminum panel powder coat and Lizard Skin insulation
Mustang style coolant routing and aftermarket expansion tank
High finish interior including dash, gauges/switches, carpet, headliner, etc.
Cruise control (maybe)
Aftermarket wipers and washers (not Lucas)
All LED lighting, footwell lights, trunk light, backup light, center brake light in spoiler
Breeze locking cap under LeMans cap
Rigid stainless fuel and brake lines, Pro-M 3/8-inch fuel pump hangar
Floor mod above trunk (like in the Roadsters) to claim unused space above the tank, with a hinged cover
Color and stripe (if used) TBD. Thinking about blue, but I’ve said that before. Kind of stuck on candy red. We’ll see.

Received word and a picture from Factory Five that my Coupe was finished on the promised date and ready for pickup. Lost a few days due to the Thanksgiving weekend, but Stewart picked it up earlier this week and today was delivery day. Driver arrived just before lunchtime as promised, and everything is in my garage now. The backorder list is about one page long. Shorter than my Anniversary Roadster, but missing some key parts. Front LCA’s, all four IRS control arms, and toe arms. Once I complete the inventory I’ll talk to Factory Five and hopefully get some updates about the backorders. In general, the chassis and body look great. No obvious defects with the body that I can see. As noted in the title, my Coupe has serial number 59.

I’m doing this build thread with the pictures hosted on the forum. I’ve used Photobucket for some years. But because of changes they made regarding third party hosting and costs, going another direction. First pic is in the rack at Factory Five. Balance are from the delivery completed today.








Away we go!
 
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#79 ·
Well, the Coyote in general isn't going to win any beauty contests. But I have some ideas if the Gen 3 ends up working and I can get one.
 
#80 ·
Thanks for sharing the pictures!

Things I noticed as just random observations:
  • The valve covers are molded a lot tighter to the cams than before which makes things look like they stick up more
  • Exhaust cam phasers solenoids and wiring are moved aft from the Gen 1 and 2 while the intake cams look the same
  • The oil filter mounting location seems moved forward
  • The CMCV actuators look mounted slightly lower and more compact
  • Throttle body may be pointed at a higher angle than before
 
#83 · (Edited)
Gen 3 Coyote News

Well, big news today. After crawling all over the Gen 3 Coyote at Detroit Autorama on Saturday, measuring and studying as best I could, looking at build pictures, etc. came up with a definite maybe that it would fit into the Gen 3 Coupe. To finally try to nail this down, asked Mike Everson for more pictures of his Gen 3 Coupe build with the Coyote already installed. Also sent a note to Jesper at Factory Five to see if they've done any CAD models with the Gen 3 Coyote in the Gen 3 Coupe. I'm two for two with responses. Rather than pictures, Mike and I talked through the possible concern, how it compared to his build, available space, etc. The conclusion was the Gen 3 Coyote should fit. Thanks Mike! Literally while I was talking to Mike, received an email from Jesper also confirming it would fit, and these two awesome CAD renderings. He said it was OK to post them. Thanks Jesper! I added an arrow to the second pic where there was interference concern. Clearly looks OK.

So, the ball is back in Ford's court. Let's get this thing released. Unless availability goes completely south, going to try to make the build happen with this engine.


 
#84 ·
well, big news today. After crawling all over the gen 3 coyote at detroit autorama on saturday, measuring and studying as best i could, looking at build pictures, etc. Came up with a definite maybe that it would fit into the gen 3 coupe. To finally try to nail this down, asked mike everson for more pictures of his gen 3 coupe build with the coyote already installed. Also sent a note to jesper at factory five to see if they've done any cad models with the gen 3 coyote in the gen 3 coupe. I'm two for two with responses. Rather than pictures, mike and i talked through the possible concern, how it compared to his build, available space, etc. The conclusion was the gen 3 coyote should fit. Thanks mike! Literally while i was talking to mike, received an email from jesper also confirming it would fit, and these two awesome cad renderings. He said it was ok to post them. Thanks jesper! I added an arrow to the second pic where there was interference concern. Clearly looks ok.

So, the ball is back in ford's court. Let's get this thing released. Unless availability goes completely south, going to try to make the build happen with this engine.


great news paul!!!
 
#85 · (Edited)
A/C – Heat Installation Underway Plus

Relatively minor updates today. Yesterday I finished installation of the A/C – Heat unit in the PS footbox. Needed a couple extra arms to hold it in place while marking the attachment locations. I used a jackstand with a stack of towels for my assistant. First time I’ve used one of those on the inside of a build. The evaporator unit has four designed attachment points with inserts into the case. But for this installation, only one can be used. The FF instructions show using self-tapping screws into the top of the plastic case for two other attachments. My belt and suspenders mindset said change those to two 10-32 machine screws with a washer and locknut inside. Both nuts were accessible through the air outlets. One easy, the other a little harder. But done and solid. I put 10-32 nutserts into the chassis at the attachment points rather than the provided self-tappers. Again, just my thing. I had a suggestion to put the unit in straight versus angled as shown in the instructions. But after mocking it up, didn’t see how that was possible. To get it as high and far back as possible, plus making all the connections accessible, looks to me like it can only go this way. But it’s OK IMO.

The instructions (available on Factory Five’s website) first steps show cutting an access area into the PS footbox. Not a big deal, but I wasn’t looking forward to that necessarily or making a cover. I was pleasantly surprised to find my sheetmetal already had the access cut and the cover made held in place with the usual shipping screws. Just hadn’t noticed that before. Maybe a running change. I didn't order the A/C - Heat option at the same time as my kit. I guess they're now putting the access on all the kits. Nice.

Couple pics of the installed unit. From the cockpit.


Looking down into the footbox.


I’m not going to do anything else with this for now. Need a lot more other assembly to be finished and engine installed before running hoses, wiring, etc. I mentioned before this is a pretty simple setup with two outlets on the inside unit. One going to a pair of dash outlets. The other to the two defroster outlets. I am planning to change that up a little. Instead of pointing the two outside outlets down, I’m going to put them on the face of the dash. Then I’m going to add two additional outlets in the center of the dash. I’ll use Y-connections and add them to the defroster hose. That will add more air directly to the occupants versus having half going against the windshield. If more defroster air is needed, just close one or both of the center dash outlets. Not real high tech, but I think a little more user friendly.

Couple other things I worked on. Since I have a hydraulic clutch, won’t use the clutch cable exit in the DS footbox. So I’m going to use that for the reservoir hoses, which works out well since I’m planning to put the reservoirs in front of the DS footbox. The outlets on the Tilton triple reservoir I’m using are 5/16-inch barb, and the inlets on the Wilwood MC’s are 1/4-inch barb. Could use a reducer, but that’s just more connections. So today I tried fitting the supplied Wilwood 1/4-inch reservoir hose onto the Tilton piece. Took some heat, liquid soap, and healthy persuasion times three. But they’re on and I think it’s going to work fine. I’ll add some clamps and they’ll be good to go. Then made a small aluminum plate with holes for the three hoses with grommets and riveted onto the DS footbox front piece. I’ll have to trim the grommets a little to co-exist in this small area, but this should work. Don’t have the grommets yet. Also haven't mounted the triple reservoir yet. I want to set the tip-up nose in place and confirm the available height. I suspect I have plenty, but don't want to mess it up. While I had the footbox front piece out, also added some clearance for the front brake line that exits below the top frame tube. Then spent 15 minutes trying to figure out how that piece goes back in. It's a bit of a puzzle. :p


Finished up the rear harness. I installed the pigtails shown previously for the backup lights and reverse lockout solenoid, tested, and then wrapped everything up. Then installed into the chassis. With the fuel and brake lines on the DS of the transmission tunnel, installed it on the PS. Crossed over to the dash area on a diagonal frame piece. Added a hole to the DS sheet metal for it to come through. The same location as the rear brake line leaving the footbox. I’m planning the hydraulic line for the clutch will go through this same spot. I'll add some edge protector on the sheet metal after powder coat.


I’ve finished laying out the trunk storage box and was planning to start working on that today. I was planning to order some aluminum sheet from Aircraft Spruce like I’ve done before. But I was told about a metal supplier, Alro, that has a retail store about 25 minutes away. By all accounts it’s a great source. So I'm going to check it out. But we managed to get another bunch of snow today, so I didn’t go anywhere. Haven’t even cleaned the driveway off yet. Being retired has its privileges. Hopefully will make it out tomorrow and get started on that. Waiting for the call that my first batch of powder coat parts is done. Then will have some more parts to install.
 
#86 ·
I mentioned before this is a pretty simple setup with two outlets on the inside unit. One going to a pair of dash outlets. The other to the two defroster outlets. I am planning to change that up a little. Instead of pointing the two outside outlets down, I’m going to put them on the face of the dash. Then I’m going to add two additional outlets in the center of the dash. I’ll use Y-connections and add them to the defroster hose. That will add more air directly to the occupants versus having half going against the windshield. If more defroster air is needed, just close one or both of the center dash outlets. Not real high tech, but I think a little more user friendly.
Love this idea - looking forward to seeing what you do, especially the extra vents in the center dash!
 
#87 ·
Im curious about the defroster because I have the same issue of not having a dedicated defroster circuit that can be turned on/off. I was going to just put a normal ball vent on the dash but have a feeling that even closed, the leaking AC air will cause condensation on the windshield all the time. (im in FL)
Any thoughts on that? Anyone have that setup in a hot climate coupe?
 
#88 ·
I don't know. Since the A/C circuit dehumidifies the air going through it to some extent, I'm not expecting (hoping...) it's a problem. But our air here in MI, while humid sometimes, is nothing like FL. Another aspect, perhaps, is that this system isn't using outside air. It's drawing air out of the footwell and by definition is always in recirculating mode. I don't consider it a problem or worth pursuing because the Coupe is hardly airtight as it is. But perhaps that would make a difference as well? Maybe someone else has actual experience with this.
 
#90 ·
I'm assuming that a coupe caught in a rainstorm is almost undriveable without defroster/defogger and wiper system, and that an AC vent blasting on the WS would clear that up.
The issue Im talking about is the other 99% of the time would the leaking A/C air from the defroster vent cause that annoying water condensation on the outside of the windshield that would then streak up all the time? Anyhow, maybe that's a topic for a seperate post lol.
 
#92 · (Edited)
FWIW, I've been in several rain storms in my roadster with the soft top on and no side windows. The only method of defogging the inside of the windshield quickly was the AC. Switching from AC to heater takes some time for the heater core to warm up and overcome the cold AC core. The AC dehumidifies the air while the heater delivers warm moist air. The heater may do the job given time but while driving down the road seconds count. Switching back to AC removed the fog quickly. Even though the AC/heater is in constant recirculation mode with the intake inside the car, there is a copious amount of air being exchanged inside to outside.

Also, I've never experienced the AC causing condensation on the windshield but perhaps Texas doesn't have the 100% humidity found in Florida.
 
#93 ·
Gen 3 Coyote has sprayed on cylinder liners?

I happened upon a Youtube video of some Ford engineers discussing the 2018 Mustang and I think they said it has sprayed or sputtered on cylinder liners to gain a very small increase in the bore and decrease engine weight.
So my question is when has that ever ended well? If that is true and I was in the market for a Coyote (and I am not) I think I would go with the Gen2 and the steel liners.

Comments?
 
#94 ·
I happened upon a Youtube video of some Ford engineers discussing the 2018 Mustang and I think they said it has sprayed or sputtered on cylinder liners to gain a very small increase in the bore and decrease engine weight.
So my question is when has that ever ended well? If that is true and I was in the market for a Coyote (and I am not) I think I would go with the Gen2 and the steel liners.

Comments?
Hey Mark. I hear you. Sounds a little like Chevy Vega days again, right? Aluminum block without a steel liner. (I was one of their victims. Boy that was a while ago...). But what Ford is doing with the Gen 3 Coyote isn't new and is apparently well proven. It's called the plasma transfer wire arc process. For Ford, they've been using it in the GT500 engine since 2011. It's also used in the latest GT350 Voodoo engine. Now taking it from those lower quantity but high performance engines to the masses with the base Coyote starting with the Gen 3. I'm reading test cases of 250,000 miles and still good. It's also used in the Nissan GT-R and other industries such as aerospace gas turbines. Looks like solid technology. I'm OK with it.
 
#96 ·
It's not remotely the same. Hopefully you read my whole post. But that was the first thing I thought of when I read the Gen 3 release info. Mark kind of reminded me of it again. :001_rolleyes:
 
#98 ·
So it is not Nikasil or it is a better process?

From a common Jaguar AJ V8 engine problems list:

AJ-V8
The AJ-V8 was designed to use Nikasil-coated cylinders rather than the more-common iron cylinder liners. However, like the BMW M60, high-sulphur fuel reacted with the Nikasil liners and caused engine failures. Jaguar replaced affected engines, and has used conventional cast-iron linings ever since.

Longevity is probably not a real issue in these cars as very few are even close to daily drivers. (exc. Ralph Button :) )
 
#99 · (Edited)
From a common Jaguar AJ V8 engine problems list:

AJ-V8
The AJ-V8 was designed to use Nikasil-coated cylinders rather than the more-common iron cylinder liners. However, like the BMW M60, high-sulphur fuel reacted with the Nikasil liners and caused engine failures. Jaguar replaced affected engines, and has used conventional cast-iron linings ever since.

Longevity is probably not a real issue in these cars as very few are even close to daily drivers. (exc. Ralph Button :) )
No, it's not Nikasil. Here's an interesting article on the process. Even addresses how it's different than the Jaguar event. https://jalopnik.com/5467038/the-ford-engine-technology-good-enough-for-the-nissan-gt-r.

But probably safe to say Mark isn't buying it. :lol:
 
#100 · (Edited)
Trunk Box Fabrication

Last week I made it to the Alro Metals Outlet not too far from me, as mentioned in my last update. Mission was to get some sheet aluminum for the trunk box I’m adding plus a couple other possible things I’ll be fabricating. It’s a pretty impressive place with a lot to choose from, including a whole bunch of reasonably priced remnants of every shape, size and metal. Unfortunately, they had almost no 6061 .040 sheet aluminum remnants. They offered to cut a piece from a full sheet, but it was 50% more than buying it on-line even with the added shipping. But I looked around and found some 5052. A couple pieces of .040 and a pretty large piece of .063 for a grand total of $31.69. Easily twice as much as needed for the trunk enclosure, so plenty left for other projects. I was planning to make the enclosure out of all .040. But the slightly thicker material on the floor and folding lid on the top is probably a good thing. The guy said I would like how 5052 bends, and in my very basic Harbor Freight brake, he was right. I could definitely tell it’s a little softer than 6061. Almost “gummy” to cut. I'm not going to use it for anything structural (even though it would probably be OK) but it’s fine for this use and the price was certainly right.

This is the box I came up with. Pretty straightforward. Cut, bend, rivet. Repeat until done. It’s 23 inches long, 16 inches wide, and 5-1/2 inches deep, not including the mounting flange around the edges. That’s a couple inches wider than the similar mod installed in #8674. Fits easily into the available space above the tank in the Coupe, and the lid swings without hitting anything.



Since this area is exposed under the rear glass hatch, decided to also make a lid. Borrowed liberally from the pictures on the Dark Water Customs site. I hinged it so that it’s split in the middle. Back half can be opened by itself, or the whole thing flipped over. I’ll have a piece of edged carpet over the lids, attached only to the rear section. Still need to figure out some kind of pull or handle. The stainless piano hinges are from McMaster.



Once it’s time to install, will need to do some final trimming on the box to fit around the chassis tubes in the area and also cut a hole in the existing floor. Some relocate the chassis tubes in the Roadsters with this mod. I’ve done the mod twice on Roadsters and didn’t. They appear to be even more structural on the Gen 3 Coupe, so that isn’t anything I’m remotely considering. I’ve found using the storage area with the cross braces isn’t a big deal. Probably some will notice I didn’t put the fuel gauge sender access panel in the new box. I also won’t have one in the pump area. I don’t find dropping the tank to be a big deal, especially with a lift, so I prefer not to mess around with the access panels. In multiple seasons, have only had to drop the tank once and that was when I upgraded the pump and hanger in #8674. Nothing had actually failed. Probably shouldn’t say that out loud…

Received a few more pieces off my shopping list last week. Picked up the Tilton 60-6104 hydraulic throwout bearing I’m going to use instead of the more traditional TOB and clutch arm setup. Actually they call it a Hydraulic Release Bearing (HRB). Oh good. Another acronym. It appears to be an extremely high quality piece. I’m very impressed. Hope it works as good as it looks. Checked what I could and it appears that it will fit OK. Also picked up a Moroso 63806 coolant expansion tank. Like I did with #8674, planning to plumb the cooling system the same as a Mustang versus using a T-filler and overflow tank. Ford said the plumbing is unchanged on the Gen 3 Coyote, and the Moroso tank is also now advertised for the 2018 Mustang. So should be good to go. I’m not sure where it will be mounted just yet. I’m thinking somewhere in this area. But won’t know until the real engine, intake, etc. is installed. It looks like the intake would still fit behind it, but not sure yet. Will need to figure out some mounting brackets.


Also received the Breeze #35317 Locking Aero Fuel Cap. Another high quality part. I've used this cap on each of my builds and like it a lot. With a little bit of trimming, fits perfectly into the LeMans cap. Seals things up and provides a solid lock. I’ve spent quite a bit of time over the last couple days planning what I want to do with the instrument panel. Starting to get a little more focused I think. Trying to come up with the right layout, switches, etc. that looks decent and belongs together. I’ll have something to share eventually.

This Saturday we’re having a club event (Great Lakes Cobra Club) here at our house. Couple years ago when #8674 was going together, invited everyone over for coffee, donuts, and sharing about the build. It was a lot of fun and had a good turnout. So we’re doing the same with the Coupe build. Looking forward to it. Once that’s done, the back half of the body is coming off and I’ll dig into drilling and fitting aluminum panels. It’s time.
 
#101 · (Edited)
Wipers Plus

My build plan includes wipers and I’m going to do washers as well. Both are required by the Michigan safety inspection. I’ve gotten away without washers on the Roadster builds thanks to sympathetic LEO’s. But not going to try again, plus maybe with this build the wipers and washers might actually be usable and necessary. But I don’t want to work through the Lucas drama for wipers again, so looked for an alternative. Found reference to a company Specialty Power Windows located in Georgia on several other forums. Seemed all good. They sell various performance car power windows and wiper setups, including a universal wiper system WWK-2. Pretty old school. You actually have to call them to order. What??? Found that Speedway sells their products, was in stock, and with a few clicks here two days later. Looked it over today, put together enough to see how it works, and have a basic plan for installing. The overall design is similar to the Lucas variety with a moving cable going through wheelboxes. But it’s quite heavy duty and seems rock solid. Configuration, direction, and amount of sweep are all adjustable. Also in my digging around, found reference to a wiper/washer switch that does everything the usual DD does. Push for washer and several wipes, variable intermittent, high, low, and park. Cool! The one I bought is a Cole Hersee 75600-04. They sell a bunch of variations. After studying the switch schematic and the wiper setup, determined this was the right one. Clipped everything together temporarily, and it all works as it’s supposed to. The wiper kit doesn’t come with arms or blades. Need to figure that out. But even once those are added, what I’m going to install will still be cheaper than the usual Lucas knock-off and I think (hope) quite a bit better.

Had to chuckle a little bit. The literature says these wipers were the Best New Product of the Year at the 1991 NSRA nationals. My first reaction was these are maybe kind of an old design. Then on second thought realized that's 30 years or so newer than the Lucas style wipers. OK, that's progress. Here are some pics.

Inside of main mechanism. Orientation of the drive wheel determines direction. Different holes to adjust the amount of sweep. The wheel boxes come with a long driveshaft that can be shortened, which I probably will need to do. Everything gets packed with grease when assembled for good.


Motor and the Cole Hersee switch. I’ll be changing out the knob to match the others on the dash. Drive cable is in the background.


Expect to mount somewhere in this vicinity. Plenty of room and should link up OK with the wheelboxes.


I mentioned before about picking up the Breeze locking gas cap and installing into the LeMans cap. Got that done the other night. I’ve shown this including a full description in my other build threads, so won't repeat the details. Cut off the LeMans connection, hog out the flange for the regular cap, and bolt in. Not cheap, but an ideal setup IMO.



Spent more time on the interior layout. Feel like I’m about there. There are some amazing interiors out there. I’m trying to stay within the basic boundaries of the stock layout though. I’m thinking of putting together a small center switch panel. The ends will be boxed in and have the aux outlets. Only switches on the dash itself will be the ignition, headlights and horn button over by the gauges. Probably going to go keyless push button start. Turn signals will be the Russ Thompson unit with headlight low/high/flash to pass on the stalk button. Four A/C-Heat outlets on the face of the dash, and I’d really like to install a glovebox. Probably can’t be real deep because of all the hoses behind the dash, but I’m going to try. I’ll have to do some fabrication on the DS to move things over a bit to fit the outlet on that side. Brow piece is still optional at this point. I’m planning to have the panel with the gauges removable which opens the dash area for access and servicing. Thinking of finishes of vinyl, C-F and some red stitching. Along the lines of how the seats are finished. Something similar for door cards as well. Again, very preliminary but it’s a start. What do you think? At this point changes are as easy as cutting more kraft paper and printing switch images.



My first batch of powder coat pieces are promised for early next week. Also found out today Factory Five is sending out an update package for all Gen 3 Coupe buyers. There have been some sheet metal changes and maybe more. I’m really not sure. Some have gone out already. Mine is due in the next week or two. Good customer service Factory Five.
 
#102 ·
Always enjoy the updates and it's looking great Paul! Gauges appear to be pretty near exactly vertical; is your view from the seat OK or are you considering tipping them a bit so that the faces are perpendicular with your line of sight?

Jeff
 
#104 ·
Thanks Jeff. I have fun doing them. Glad you like the rambling. I'm expecting the gauges may move to the right just a little when I mod the dash to fit the DS HVAC outlet. So I haven't checked the sight lines much yet. Will adjust if necessary. Tipping them toward the driver is an interesting idea. I'll see about that. But not sure it's necessary. These particular gauges are bigger than the smallish Roadster gauges. Plus maybe you can see the smaller ones on the dash are sticking out some. They have spacer rings on the front right now that actually go on the back. Just haven't taken the time to change. So in final form they sit closer to the dash like the tach and speedo.

Looks good Paul, nothing wrong with a stock approach!! Think about interior lighting too. I’m working on that when I get my chassis back from the painter on the weekend.

John
Thanks John. Yea, I'm planning LED downlights on the underside of the dash ends on the courtesy light circuit. Just didn't mention in this update. Watching your paint progress!
 
#103 ·
Looks good Paul, nothing wrong with a stock approach!!
Think about interior lighting too. I’m working on that when I get my chassis back from the painter on the weekend.

John
 
#105 ·
Body Off Plus

It’s been a busy week since the last update. Still forging ahead. I was hoping to have some powder coat parts back and start installing. But haven’t gotten the call yet. But other things to talk about. I mentioned before we were going to have a Great Lakes Cobra Club event at our house. Happened last Saturday. Had a great turnout. After donuts and coffee, made it to the garage where I rambled for a while and then we just had a good time checking out the Coupe build, talking shop, and visiting with great friends. Then went to a barbeque place for lunch. Doesn’t get better than that! Hope my buddies don’t mind me posting these pictures. These are also in the public gallery on our club’s website, so should be OK here too.



Today I removed the body for the first time. But first a few other updates. During the open house we set the nose on the chassis to see what it looked like (good to have lots of help) and I took the opportunity to measure the clearance under the area where I wanted to put the triple reservoir for brakes and clutch. Was 4+ inches, so the 3 inches I planned for them above the frame was fine. Should give good flow into the master cylinders. I was going to just tap 1/4-20 threads into the frame. But decided to use heavy duty nutserts instead. Was interesting working in that tight space. But got it done and the reservoir mounted. I mounted it with the caps level. The top frame member angles down toward the front. I think it’s going to work out well here.


Also decided to make some progress with the wiper installation. Unlike the Roadster, the Coupe has the wiper locations molded into the body. Nice flat surface to bolt against on the outside but not on the inside. After drilling the holes centered at the right location, found it a little challenging to get the wheel box bolted in adequately. But the wiper system came with 5/8-inch long steel spacers that are intended to be welded into a steel body if necessary. Decided to use those. Shaped the ends so they fit into the contours in the underside of the wiper locations. Then spot glued with HSRF using the wheelboxes to make sure they were at the right angle. When that set up, put a pretty big filet of HSRF around each. Doesn’t look pretty, but doesn’t need to. The wheel box mounts are now rock solid and held perfectly at the proper angle.


Cut and flared the tubes for the cable to run in.


Installed where they belong.


The wiper motor assembly came with a “universal” mounting plate that I didn’t use as is. Instead, harvested two pieces out of it, added as outriggers using the bolts already there holding the assembly together, and mounted some rubber shock mounts I had on hand. These will bolt to the firewall. I’ll get the final position and make up the last piece of tubing when the body goes on for the final fitting. I remain very pleased with this Specialty Power Windows (SPW) wiper system. It's kind of like the Lucas style system on steroids. Everything is bigger, heavier, and very solid. I've had it wired up a couple times and it seems to work very well. Now just need to find some arms and wiper blades. But plenty of time for that.

 
#107 ·
I remain very pleased with this Specialty Power Windows (SPW) wiper system. It's kind of like the Lucas style system on steroids. Everything is bigger, heavier, and very solid.
The same can be said about the window regulator mechanisms from Specialty Power Windows. I'll add that the parts are easily modified and their tech support is very helpful. The units are a bit bulky, but with the other mods I made they will do the job nicely.
 
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#106 ·
Body Off Plus (continued)

Today my side windows were delivered. These are new for the Gen 3 Coupe. Similar I guess as previous ones, but I really don’t know since I haven’t seen any others. I had seen some preliminary pics, but not the final version. Consists of a powder coated metal frame, plexi insert with a sliding panel (pre-assembled BTW), mounting brackets to mount it to the door frame, rubber gasket material to mount the window into the frame, and a bunch of hardware. Even comes with an installation tool for the rubber gasket. Interesting. No instructions yet so I’m not positive how it all goes together. The packing list did show two pieces backordered. Listed as plexi rear quarter windows. I'm assuming the kit provided scoops are replaced with a flat piece? Makes sense, but I don't know for sure. I won’t be doing anything with this for a while. I’m sure there will be more information by then. This isn’t the best picture, but snapped this pic with one of the frames and windows on my work bench. Not cheap, but I’m happy with the quality.


So today I removed the body for the first time. I had hooks in the ceiling of my other garage, and had removing and installing the Roadster body all figured out doing it by myself. Pretty easy actually once you follow the proper sequence. I decided to try using my lift (watch too many car shows on Velocity I guess…) to take the Coupe body off. So put the chassis on wheel dollies, tied the body to the arms of the lift, and slowly lifted it off. It’s similar to the Roadster in that the sides need to pulled out to clear the undersides and door hinges. Also once it starts to move, needs to go a foot or more back to clear the back of the frame. I used towels wherever it was contacting the frame, trying not to mark up the powder coat. Took it slow and worked OK. But unfortunately, with the lift all the way up the body still didn’t clear the roll bar cage. So moved stuff around in the garage and was able to roll the chassis out of the way enough to set the body back down. I was going to use my Roadster body buck and modify as necessary. But it wasn’t even close. Would have been a complete rebuild. But in the end, decided a buck wasn’t even necessary. The sides of the body are straight and it sits flat on those with the back just slightly elevated. So I’m storing it that way with some blocks and towels under the back so there’s no pressure. It should be fine. It’s not particularly heavy. Maybe even lighter than the nose piece. But is a little bulky and floppy to move around. I decided to store it in the back of my Serpent Express trailer that’s parked outside by the garage. I don’t use the trailer too much, and it’s an easy in and out when I do. Also gave me a chance to see how the Coupe is going to fit into my 14-foot SE. Pretty much as expected, it doesn’t. Looks like it will stick out the back 6-8 inches which would keep the back door from zipping up. Still useable, but not ideal. Anyway, some pics. I've been used to seeing the chassis with the body on. Sure looks different now.




Summary for me is that I was able to get the body off by myself. But 99% certain I won’t try that again. It would be really easy with a couple helpers, and that’s probably what I’ll do in the future. Next steps now will be to start locating and drilling aluminum panels.
 
#108 ·
I was concerned with a few areas of the body changing shape if unsupported. Our body was off for two years. We braced between the pontoons to stop spreading and twisting. Next we braced across the rocker panels to stop spreading. We built a brace to hold the cowl from sagging and attached that to the rocker brace. Last we braced the roof at the center of the windshield to prevent the roof from sagging. Your body may be back on fast enough that any of this could be a waste of time, but it was nice that the front and rear windows fit. Your cars look great and keep up the good work.

Glen
 
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#109 ·
Thanks for your comments. I'm only expecting the body off for some months. The way the main part of the boy is sitting right now -- with the pontoons flat on the ground and the rear supported -- I don't see how it's supported much less than if it were mounted on the chassis. The cowl I have propped up against the wall at the other end of the garage. It's sitting nose up with the other end flat on the ground. Also not stressful and don't see how it could be hurt that way. Once the weather is warmer, and I'm further along with the chassis, I'm planning to work on the body pieces outside (hate fiberglass dust indoors) to get them all cleaned up, trimmed, etc. then back on the chassis by fall. All should be fine.
 
#110 ·
Aluminum Panels – Here We Go

Started serious work on the getting all the panels fitted, drilled, etc. prior to powder coat. Including installing the trunk box fabricated and shown earlier. But first some observations. While there are some similarities to the aluminum panel layout used in the Roadster, they are of course all different parts installed in a different sequence. Before removing them, I spent a lot of time reviewing the instruction manual confirming how they are installed, overlap direction, etc. I quickly realized that panel installation is in multiple places in the manual. I ended up taking quite a bit of time searching and finding all the panel installation steps (electronic version of the manual with searching is nice), listing them in sequence, and also listing the major steps between.

What I found is that 29 aluminum pieces are installed before the body, and 24 after the body is installed. That’s very different than the Roadster, where all the panels except the splash guards and a couple pieces by the radiator can be mounted without the body installed. Explains why I had a little more trouble than I should have removing the body. Also has me re-thinking how I’m going to do heat and sound insulation. Some of the pieces that aren’t installed until after the body are the sides and rear for the hatch/trunk area and the rear cockpit corners. I’ve masked and sprayed Lizard Skin on all of my builds, and was planning to do the same for the Coupe. But that was already looking a little tough with the additional obstacles (roll cage, etc.) and now not having all the panels installed first. Has me thinking as well about maybe putting insulation on the outside of the footboxes. Something I’ve avoided on previous builds because I’m not a fan of the look. But that might be the best solution here. More thinking and planning ahead on this subject.

One other observation. For the Roadsters I’ve found the panels were installed in the shipping locations with all the overlaps the direction they were supposed to be installed. I didn’t find that to be the case here. The pictures and sequence shown in the instruction manual has a number of differences from how my kit was received. No big deal. Just an observation and something to watch.

Back to actual build progress, cut the hole in the floor piece, fit the trunk box around the frame rails, and have the floor and box cleco’d in. Happy with how it turned out. I’ll install the folding cover later after installing carpet. Next week I’ll finish the hatch/trunk area, work on the cockpit, and probably take the block and transmission back out so I can start working on the footboxes.



This is pretty minor, but after a couple tries found a shift lever I’m happy with. 6-inch long Hurst 5387201 is a good length and angle for my setup. Chrome plated steel so a nice solid piece, and wasn’t expensive. The shift ball is one that came with my TKO on the last build, so not the right shift pattern on it. I’ll need to find something similar for the T-56. I’m impressed with how easily and precisely the T-56 clicks through all six gears. I think it’s going to be a winner.


One last follow-up item. Received the Gen 3 side windows as described and pictured in a previous update. There was an open question about the rear quarter windows since the kit comes with a scoop for that opening. Not too useful if you’re trying to keep the elements out. I received the backordered quarter windows that go with the windows. They are designed to go on the inside of the quarter window opening. The outside scoops wouldn’t need to be removed. But the inside panels would close the opening. Maybe the previous Coupes were the same way. But this is new to me and I had gotten a question or two.
 
#112 ·
No worries. What I'm mocking up now, which may or may not resemble the final version, is easily reachable when strapped in. Nothing is further away than the FF stock locations. Whatever the final result is will be the same. Thanks for your message and concern.
 
#114 ·
Still At It

Work on fitting and drilling panels continues. Rear hatch area almost done. Making good progress on the cockpit. Still on the same new drill bit I started with. (Probably shouldn’t say that…) Everything is fitting pretty well. Mainly just the usual minor tweaks on bends and needing to trim around welds occasionally. I’m planning to have the two front transmission covers removable. So will use countersunk rivets along the top edge of the floor pieces. That front hatch floor piece (removed in this picture, but just behind the rear cockpit wall ) is a bear. No less than four pictures in the manual showing exactly how to bend it to get in and out. Still not easy. Put some heavy duty tape on the roll bars or you’re liable to really scratch up the powder coat in the process.


I had this in my last build thread, but will show again. This 6-inch seamer/bender from Harbor Freight works great to adjust bends for this work. I use it a lot at this stage. https://www.harborfreight.com/6-inch-jaw-straight-sheet-metal-seamer-98728.html


I mentioned before about needing to get a shift ball that I liked plus had the T-56 6-speed shift pattern on it. Then I was reminded that Tremec offers them for free if you go to their website and register your new Tremec transmission. Done. They have several varieties and either SAE or metric adapters. Nice quality pieces and the price is right.

The weather is finally starting to warm up. Hopefully will be able to get #8674 out of the garage soon and get some driving in. Will cut into build time. But I’m willing to make that sacrifice. :cool:
 
#115 · (Edited)
Powder Coat Plus

Received the call late last week that my first batch of 39 powder coat parts was done. I’m expecting some updated aluminum panels from Factory Five soon. The cockpit is fitted and drilled and just a little more to do in the hatch area. Then I’ll stop and wait for the updated panels. Meanwhile, picked up the powder coated parts and worked with those for a while. These I had done in gloss black to match the chassis. Mainly all the fabbed metal parts and the radiator tunnel and shroud. I’m planning to do the second batch, all the aluminum panels, in a similar silver as the Anniversary Roadster. Like the color, it’s easy to take care of, and looks good against the gloss black.

Everything looked good. Lots of parts. I know not everything will be visible once complete. But still like to have everything coated.


Installed the fan shroud and fan on the radiator. Not too visible here, but the fan shroud was just slightly too tall for the mounting on the radiator. Plus it needed to be up slightly at the bottom to not interfere with the tunnel because of the angle it sits at. So before powder coat, riveted a strip along the top with a spacer between. It slips down over the top of the flange on the top of the radiator and only has bolts on the bottom. They did a good job of keeping powder coat out of the slot. It was a tight fit without any coating.


I won’t mount the tunnel pieces or radiator permanently until after the engine is installed. Just makes it easier to reach, plus keep from banging things up. So just a couple clecos for now to see how it looks.


I spent some time assembling the door frames, hinges, door latches, handles, etc. Thought about cutting the doors open and installing the frames. But decided to wait until full on body work time. No need to be making fiberglass dust just yet. Plus I really want to fit the doors in the body before cutting anything. But still went ahead and temporarily put the door frames on the chassis. Everything fits and works really well. Very happy so far.


The hinges I had welded, shown in an earlier post, turned out really nice. The hinges and bear claw latch are rock solid. The hinges and part of the frame are exposed out of the front of the door.


Another builder posted a picture of the new Gen 3 windows and the mounting interfering with the door handle. So checked that out. Using the just received windows, determined where the mounting will be on the doors. Then where the instructions show to mount the inside door handle. Everything is fine. Clearly this has been sorted out. Also figured out the window brackets lower mounting bolts are intended to be through the door frame inside the door. Good. This is rough, but how things lay out. I’ll cut and drill later.


Another small project was to finish and install my in-tank fuel pump. I had everything I needed except for the step-down butt connectors. Received those, so finalized the assembly and installed in the fuel tank. The tank is ready for final installation. The connectors I ended up using are Molex 19164-0077. From DelCity, but available elsewhere. They’re crimp and heat shrink, and advertised specifically for harsh environments including gasoline. On #8674, I used similar connectors from West Marine, although not specifically listed for gasoline. I soaked those for a couple days and determined they were OK (and made for some interesting banter in my build thread…). But these look better. Minimum order was 10, so I had extras. I took the opportunity to practice and pull test the joints before installing them for real on the pump. Good thing. My first choice for the dies on my crimper didn’t work too well. Sorted that out and I think they came out fine. As mentioned before, this is a Pro-M Racing High Flow fuel pump hanger. Has full 3/8-inch supply and return lines and -AN6 connections. You can see in the pic how the return line goes to the bottom of the sump. Because of that, it’s a little challenging to install. The instructions show how to cut the fuel tank opening to allow it to fit in. I found you don’t have to cut it quite as much as they show. But still is necessary. That plus the usual twisting and turning to get the pump and filter through the opening and into position. So if you decide to go with this hanger, obviously best to do the trimming before putting fuel in the tank. I used a Walbro GSS340BX 255 lph fuel pump. Lots of discussion about what size pump to use with the Coyote. This is the same pump and fuel line setup as #8674, which has proven to work well.


Last up, received my Russ Thompson turn signal setup. Have been on the waiting list for a while, but sounds like he’s got another good supply of the VW turn signal assemblies so is now filling orders. He was still proving out the exact setup for the Gen 3 Coupe. Worked with Mike Everson on his build, and then sent me several different spacers with instructions to try. Was pretty easy to get sorted out and installed. I like this top mount better than the angled bottom mount used on the Roadsters. As I understand, new Roadster kits have a similar steering column mount now.


Was really hoping to be driving #8674 soon. Woke up Easter Sunday morning to snow. Grrr! It’s gone now, but still pretty chilly out. Come on. Meanwhile, plenty to do on the build.
 
#116 ·
Looking good Paul.

You are on the right track with the doors.
You first want to hang the frames and make that work.
Remove the frames.
Then hang the body
Put the frames back on and fit the skins in the body opening.
Then mount to the frames.

John
 
#125 ·
Looking good Paul.



You are on the right track with the doors.

You first want to hang the frames and make that work.

Remove the frames.

Then hang the body

Put the frames back on and fit the skins in the body opening.

Then mount to the frames.



John


I wish I had done mine that way. It seems like a much better plan than my methodology turned out to be.

Looking great!
 
#117 ·
if your doors fit like mine you will need to trim mostly from the back or you end up with a lot of washers under the latch striker. So yes fit the door frame and latch first then the door skin.
David W
 
#118 ·
Awesome build Paul, really like your style and innovative thinking especially your choice of upgraded parts. Your craftsmanship is one cut above also!
Your build got me interested in building another FFR - Gen 3 coupe.
I noticed your first build page indicated you bought a "complete kit". With all the new parts why not choose a base kit? Trying which way to order since I'm planning a lot of similar upgraded parts as well.
Thanks,
BobMac
FFR3981

Bob McLaughin
 
#119 ·
Thanks Bob. Appreciate your comments. Even with some of the changes I made, the complete kit was still the way to go for me. I actually just spent a few hours the other day going through remaining boxes and consolidating unused parts into a single box. It's mostly small stuff and in many cases would be in the base kit as well. The larger items I didn't use, like the manual steering rack and seats, was able to sell pretty quickly on the forum. Some have had success in having unwanted parts removed for credit. But my experience with that hasn't been too good. Maybe I haven't tried hard enough. Regardless, what I've seen guys get credit for I can typically beat selling myself. Other stuff that is added to the complete kit -- like the wiring harness, lower control arms, spindles, fuel tank, etc. I was fine with what FF supplied. So no real reason to go elsewhere. I chose the upgraded big Wilwood brakes, so no reason to go elsewhere for brakes either. For the IRS option, I didn't go with the center section or spindles from FF. There's some potential saving to shopping around for those, plus in that case I did want something different than what FF offered. Your situation might be different, but after working through the build plan, it was a pretty easy decision for me to go with the complete kit. They're still fine tuning it, but FF did a very nice job with the Gen 3 Coupe. Come on in and join the party! Good luck whatever you decide.
 
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