Carbureted fuel system. Good install ideas needed - FFCars.com : Factory Five Racing Discussion Forum
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post #1 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-15-2019, 12:59 AM Thread Starter
Vegasjack
 
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Carbureted fuel system. Good install ideas needed

On a new build I am installing a 347CI Carbureted engine. 600 CFM Holly. IRS and drop in battery box so not a lot of space at rear end for electric pump in that area.

I currently have a 5/16 fuel line coming from the fuel tank with a single (1) pickup tube into the tank.

I have a second 1/4 inch return line, that I don't expect to use, but will not remove until I figure it out. Note/only the 5/15 spout from tank. not dual with 1/4" one,


I live in Las Vegas, so one can expect extreme heat in the summer. Vapor lock :-(

My friends and I have discussed several ways of providing fuel to the engine. As it is now, I may just go back to using the basic engine driven fuel pump.

One idea was to put the EFI pump back in the tank and put a pressure regulator to reduce the pressure down to 9 pounds (whatever) But when I read previous comments on this forum, that doesn't sound like it will work. Especially with only a 1/4" return line. But bad comments on the larger return line as well.

So, my QUESTION IS: What have you Carbureted engine builders done to suffice supplying fuel. Does a simple single pickup tube to filter to manual fuel pump work okay?

Did you use any regulators? Did you use a by-pass regulator on your manual pump system to send fuel back to tank to prevent

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post #2 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-15-2019, 01:33 AM
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I've done two carb builds. One with a somewhat warmed up 306 with stock 5/16 lines. The other a pretty potent DART 347 with 3/8 lines. Both used mechanical fuel pumps and worked great. No return lines, regulators, whatever. No reason IMO to make it any more complicated than necessary for a carb setup as long as you have the right timing cover and the eccentric on the cam. I used QuickFuels by the way and highly recommend. No trouble with vapor lock in four seasons between the two cars, although Michigan isn't hot compared to where you're at. With that engine, you should have room for a carb plate insulator on the intake if needed.

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post #3 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-15-2019, 02:07 AM Thread Starter
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Great, exactly the kind of info I am looking for. Thanks for the reply.

Jack
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post #4 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-15-2019, 01:04 PM
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Before going EFI, here was mine:

Had a fuel cell, no Mustang tank (But same applies)
External electric Low pressure fuel pump (7 PSI)(Carter)
3/8" ID Fuel Line
Quality fuel filter
Tuned Holley 650 DP Carb
Good insulators and heat shield between carb & Intake


Never any vapor lock issues, even on hot track days.

Just make sure pump is as low as possible.

Make sure you have a quality needle and seat on the Carb Floats.


Dan

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post #5 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-15-2019, 05:00 PM
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I have had a mechanical pump on the side of the engine for 12 years w/ absolutely no problems. At one point, doing other work, I drained all the fuel out of the lines. At the next startup nothing was happening and I finally realized I had forgotten to hook the hose to the pump inlet. Got it connected and thought about all the comments about these pumps being good at making pressure but poor at sucking fuel to get their initial prime. Sure enough it took some cranking before it fired. 10 seconds worth! I don't remember what brand I got from Summit but one thing to look for is to be sure it is clockable. That way, if the outlet is in an awkward position, you take out 6 screws and rotate to a better position and reinstall the 6 screws.

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post #6 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-15-2019, 06:01 PM
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347 stroker
3/8" line from tank to carb. holley mechanical pump. no regulator. no return line.
that set up gives you 6 1/2 psi which does not require a regulator. there are high volume mechanic pumps that require regulators.


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post #7 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-15-2019, 07:23 PM
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A slightly different approach for my previous cars. 3/8" lines & 5/6" returns. 427W, Carter and then an Edelbrock Vic. Jr. mechanical pump, Holley HP double pumper. Same engine in two different cars and a bunch-o-miles, temps and elevations.

I ran an Aeromotive bypass regulator and set pressures at 6?? something. While the pump, according to Edelbrock, didn't need a regulator I found that running one reduced or eliminated the boil over on hot days. Occasionally the fuel pressure gauge indicated 10+ psi, way above the normal settings, and the needles wouldn't hold the pressure and bleed through. You could watch the fuel run into the engine when not running. The bypass regulator solved the problem by giving the fuel somewhere to go.

This system never caused any problems. The pump would also pull through a Canton 8 micron filter located at the tank. I will use the same system for my current build, only change will be AN-8 lines.

If you want there are a number of electric pumps, Holley Red for one, that will provide the proper pressures for carbs without regulators. Don't forget to wire and fuse direct to the battery, using a solenoid to turn on/off. Pumps need significant power and fail without.

Jim
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post #8 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-16-2019, 12:39 AM
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Yep, the recipe that works. When switching from EFI to carb, swapped out the pick up and fuel lines and went to a mechanical fuel pump. For connection to the carbs, I used a Summit-brand hardline with a filter built in.

Here's a good site on EFI to carb:

EFI to Carburetor Conversion

Quote:
Originally Posted by luey2009 View Post
347 stroker
3/8" line from tank to carb. holley mechanical pump. no regulator. no return line.
that set up gives you 6 1/2 psi which does not require a regulator. there are high volume mechanic pumps that require regulators.

FFR4462K MKII
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post #9 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-17-2019, 12:31 AM
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Vegasjack - I live in Las Vegas as well - let me know if you want me to bring over my cobra and you can check out how I did it - I have IRS with a 427W. I have an electric pump in the tank and a regulator on the firewall. I can run either carb or EFI. I live out in the NW in the Centennial Hills area.

BTW I don't have the stack system that's in my avatar - I converted to carb - much happier that way!

Howard
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post #10 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-17-2019, 09:34 PM
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Since we are talking fuel systems. For sizing, everyone states their engine size. The important thing is how much HP is your engine going to put out. That is what the fuel system has to feed.

I have a 500hp 347. So I have to feed 500 horses. Some 347s only have to feed 340, so different requirements.

I upgraded to 3/8" lines.
I modified my pickup so it is 3/8".
I am using a engine mounted mechanical high flow Edelbrock pump. It puts out about 10 - 12 psi.
I am using a QuickFuel regulator to bring it down to 6.5psi.
That is feeding a Quickfuel Q Series 750.

I have a Fram racing high flow canister filter near the tank. (you could skip this one. Lots of debate on pre-pump filters)
I also have a filter just before the carb.

Easy, reliable setup.

The only problem I have had is that I used aluminum lines from the pump to the carb. One split on me. Never again will I have AL tubing. I redid them with stainless.


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post #11 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-18-2019, 12:31 PM
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I forgot to mention my fuel filter. It is near the tank like Avalanche's is. To add that part which I had forgotten to my story above. The work I was doing on the car was retrofitting the 2015 IRS. So I had removed the tank and the filter as well as drained the lines. It still only took 10 seconds to fire the engine.

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post #12 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-18-2019, 12:31 PM
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Lots of good replies. KEEP.......IT.......SIMPLE..!!!!

KRUSTY

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