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Fosters Build Thread

9K views 50 replies 9 participants last post by  Foster's FFR 
#1 ·
It’s time to kick off the build thread for FFR#9592. I put our order in back in February, opting for the complete kit after having read several threads on the pros and cons of complete vs. donor. So thanks to everyone who has ever shared an opinion on that particular topic.

Options selected: powdercoated frame, 3-link suspension, stainless side pipes, body cut outs, vinyl seats (researching high back seats, so went with the cheapest option here), the classic gauge set, the 15” Halibrand wheels, wind wings, sun visors, battery cut off switch, vinyl dash with glovebox, passenger and driver rollbars chromed, and the assembled side louver set.

Growing list of build mods as I read more build threads:
Second brake reservoir - too many to count
Herb's Door Panels - I think everybody
Russ's trunk mod - only a slightly smaller group than everybody
Seat Warmers - edwardb's 20th Anniversary build
Finished edges on the carpet pieces - edwardb
Dash layout with speedo in center dash - edwardb - already arranged to send back the cut dash
Toying with the idea of a push button start linked to a key fob and dropping the ignition key entirely

Actual build details to follow and a running blog to document the experience of building this with my twin sons.

A big thanks to egchewy (and everyone posting there) for starting his build first so I always have an immediate and current place to look for feedback! This has already saved me from having to pull the F panels to paint them, something I was unaware I wanted to do until I started reading that thread.

Foster
 
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#33 ·
I recommend you move the flange bearing to the inside of the foot box. This will make it much easier to fit the steering shaft onto the rack, which you will very much appreciate when you're trying to make the steering wheel level with the rack centered. You may have to grind the top of the flange so that it doesn't interfere with the bolt.


John
 
#35 ·
The pictures don't show it, but the steering rack is completely assembled. We didn't have any issues getting anything to fit. We built it from the rack up to the wheel in pieces, as it all came disassembled. Maybe that aided in avoiding the fit problem? I'll take another look at the entire thing next time I'm in the garage.

That's one of the maddening things about building this with a garage 40 minutes away, I can't just step out to check something when a question or issue comes up.

Foster
 
#34 ·
steering column

hopefully you didn't snug the wheel and adapter down too tight since you have to remove it for the dash. I was excited too to get the steering wheel on and ended up having to tap the adapter off with a plastic dead blow hammer.
 
#36 ·
hopefully you didn't snug the wheel and adapter down too tight since you have to remove it for the dash. I was excited too to get the steering wheel on and ended up having to tap the adapter off with a plastic dead blow hammer.
Thanks for the warning. I hand tightened the bolt and the cover is only loosely on as well.

I was going back through your build posts today because I thought I remembered someone advising not to install the cockpit panels until after the brake and fuel lines and the wires had been laid out. I came across the clutch quadrant post and that answered my question about where that center nut and bolt were - missing it seems. I think I used the clutch stop bolt instead. So, I'll pull that and get a replacement.
 
#37 ·
Aug/Sep Update

It's been nearly a month since my last update. The boys were away for a chunk of August and then I was away to kick off September.

Progress has been made, but it's not really the exciting kind.

Foot boxes - we cleaned, primed, and painted all the foot box panels that would be facing the engine bay. It eats up a lot of time, but the end result is satisfying.

While Nathaniel was spraying and cleaning, Miles was trying to remove the last bits of the quad shock brackets from the rear end. It seemed like they would just come off with a chisel and some pounding, but after an hour of the teenager being too nervous to go full smash with a hammer near his hand (Dad's advice: the only way your going to learn to not hit your hand is to smash it good once or twice. That's how I learned. :) ) and my full on smashing often interrupted by too much pain in my hand, not from immediate smashing mind you, but from 30 years of keyboard damage, I decided the project needed a power tool solution.

We will rent a cut off wheel from HD and go at it on Sunday. Then we can drain the fluids, paint it, and put the brakes back on.

We did a dry run on installing the rear end. Only one of the frame mounts needed a bit of spreading out and we got a good idea of where everything went. That also revealed that the traction lock brackets needed some filing down to fit better. It wouldn't snug up against the axle.

I also wondered about drilling the hole in the pumpkin flange. From a quick eyeballing, it looks like drilling will widen the current hole rather than creating a new one. The existing hole and the traction lock brace hole are nearly lined up. Is that going to be a problem?

I tore down my 302 another few steps as well. Oil pan and related components are off. Cylinders are all out. They are filthy but I don't see any physical damage. I don't see any damage on the cylinder walls, but I can't tell if they need just cleaning or a bit more. I've got to find a local engine shop to get the block cleaned as my next step. I've just got to pull the harmonic balancer, the cam, and the crank shaft and the block will be ready for cleaning and whatever other touch ups it needs.

Which brings me to a recent purchase off the classified section here. I hooked up with shady302 and got a complete MassFlo kit. I'm starting the research on that so I can figure out how to make it work with the proper fuel pickup and pump.

There it is. Things continue to get done, just not a lot of visible progress. I do feel like we are set up for a lot of things to come together pretty quickly in the near future.

Foster
 

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#38 · (Edited)
September Updates

Slow progress the last two Sundays, but progress nonetheless.

We ground off the last of the quad shock mounts on the rear axle, which set us up to paint it prior to mounting it on the frame. Our challenge was masking off the differential cover. It's an aluminum Ford Performance Racing dif cover and I couldn't get any tape to stick it it. Since I had to change out the fluid anyway we ended up pulling it off, putting into a plastic garbage bag, and then mounting it back onto the pumpkin. The bag was then taped shut over the dif cover.

With the paint done, we were able to install the upper link bracket. With that tightened down we could drill out the hole in the pumpkin. While that was happening, the rear shocks got assembled - as much as it slows me down to teach while we build, it seems like I get all or even more of that time back by having three dedicated builders. Once Miles and Nathaniel know how to do a task, they can take it over and we can be working on multiple projects in parallel.

The cockpit floors were masked off and truck bed liner applied to where they are exposed to the road under the car. I'm going to hold off on installing those until we run the brake and fuel lines so that we have as much access as possible.

We also finished breaking down the 302. It took me three tries to get the harmonic balancer off the block - the instructions that came with the puller tool I rented were poor and thus I installed it backwards twice before giving up on the instructions and figuring out how the mechanism worked against itself to pull the balancer off. With that done, Miles unscrewed the caps and Nathaniel sorted them into marked aluminum baking pans. I've located two shops that do engine cleaning and maintenance and so the next step is to get quotes and the figure out what can be salvaged.

It seems far away, but the engine and drive train install is getting closer and so we've got to get the engine sorted out. I also still need to order a flywheel and clutch.

So, we are prepped to install the rear end to the frame next Sunday. FFR tells me my back ordered wheels should show up this month, which would get our project looking a lot more like a car than it does now.

Homework when I'm not in the shop - learning about my MassFlo system and how to plumb it into the fuel system properly. So, lots of reading about fuel pumps, pickups, filters, pressure, and lines in my future.

Problems/issues - Noticed the steering rack hitting the frame. Have to double back to add some spacers under the mount. Bigger issue - had more or less decided on a red car, but saw silver_pilate's post and am now back to undecided. :)

Foster
 
#39 ·
October progress

It took us two Sundays, but we – mostly - got the rear end in place.

We started off putting the diff cover back on and getting ready to fill it. We got the cover on and bolted down, at which point we have to torque down the two support bolts and then torque down their two lock nuts. I break out the torque wrench and take care of the two support bolts. Then I go at the first lock nut – and right when it hits 20lbs, it tears the support bolt in half. Surprising. I figure I can replace it and move onto the second bolt. Same thing, sheers right off.

With the diff cover iffy, I decided not to load it with fluid, so we moved onto getting the rear end attached to the car. We’d already tried this out once, so we got it into position pretty easily. At that point we discovered that we had two missing nuts to secure the lower shock mounts.

We also had a challenging time getting the bolt in place for the panhard bar, but that seemed to resolve with a little pounding. I’m guessing it was just the powder coating, once cleaned out things fit fine. That took us to the usual point where we were all getting hungry, so we cleaned up and headed home.

I figured out that evening that my torque wrench starts at 20ftlbs. So, I over-torqued the support bolts and then they let go when I torqued down each lock nut. I searched for replacement support bolts, but could only find the entire diff cover package. So I bit the bullet and bought the same cover – a Gen 2 upgrade at least – and dug out my dad’s old-school torque wrench.

We brought that stuff up this last Sunday. Step one, pull the old diff cover off. Easily done. Maybe I can sell it used if someone out there has a cracked cover, but can salvage the support bolts. I replaced the one-week-old gasket, assuming it had some warping from being over torqued and I had a new one that came with the replacement cover.

The cover went on easily and torqued down with no issues and no damage. Having a torque wrench that started at zero and incremented by single foot-pounds was key. It’s always great when I can use one of my dad’s tools on the project. He’s contributing even though he’s not here.

With the cover on we set about filling the diff with fluid. To do this we had to fill it from the fill port on the cover while watching for overflow from the drain port on the pumpkin. Looking at the drain port I noticed the drain plug had a square hole – none of my hex wrenches would fit in there, but a 3/8” ratchet extension fit perfectly.

Nathaniel was skeptical about that solution, claiming it was luck. I pointed out that there were several things going on:

1. Ford doesn’t want just anyone pulling the pumpkin drain plug.

2. Someone who has seen enough socket sets would figure it out. I’d been working with sockets for almost 40 years now.

3. A primary reason for building the car was to demonstrate problem solving in addition to learning practical skills.

I don’t think he was impressed, but at least he wasn’t chalking it up to luck anymore. We added the friction modifier and just over 2 quarts of diff fluid.

With that finished we reattached the panhard bar and bolted down the brace from the traction lock bracket we’d overlooked last week. At that point I figured we’d toss the rear calipers back on. Turns out they interfere with the rear shocks, so now I’ve got to find a replacement set of rear calipers. And the two missing bolts for the lower shock connections.
 

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#40 ·
...At that point I figured we’d toss the rear calipers back on. Turns out they interfere with the rear shocks, so now I’ve got to find a replacement set of rear calipers...
I just posted a reply in your other thread RE: calipers and explained that swapping them to the forward location can solve the interference problem that occurs with large rotors HOWEVER there was not a photo in that post---now that I see a picture it is evident that you have the smaller rotors and the problem is that you have the calipers on the wrong sides. Put them where they belong and you should have clearance. I still prefer to mount them in the forward location because it makes for simpler parking brake routing but whether you wish to do that or just move the calipers to the correct sides is up to you.

Jeff
 
#41 ·
Thanks Jeff. That explains a lot. I don't think I even considered which side they went on. I was more focused on having the bleed port facing up. Which, in hindsight, doesn't mean I've got the correct caliper for the correct side.

I'll flip them and see what happens - downside of the garage being 45 minutes away, it'll take me until Friday to check.

Foster
 
#45 ·
Nov 6 Update

I’ve made some good progress since my last post. I had a nice October, foliage laden drive to Factory Five to pick up the last of my parts on back order. The LeMans cap fit easily into my Accord, but the two high back seats and four wheels maxed out the rest of the cargo capacity. When I build my next FFR I'm going to get an old F150. Dave pointed out where the new foundation for their expansion was going in and helped me with a couple of questions I had. He also took the time to point out the ins and outs of mounting the spinners and how to protect all of the aluminum pieces. There were two roadsters mid-build in the front room, so I took the time to look them over and compare them to what we’d put together. No glaring issues.

I drove back north to pick up the tires and get them to my local tire shop for mounting. I ended up making a Monday night run up to my garage to deliver the tires. My condo is too small to have them lying around even for a week. Of course, I couldn’t just drop them off, I had to put them on the car. They looked great. I knew they had to come back off so I could address the issue with the rear caliper brackets, but having them on did bring to mind that they brakes should be next, as I’m planning on moving the build location in January to a closer garage. It occurred to me that I could now roll the car around, but without brakes, would have to rely on brute force to stop it. Seems like a better idea to get the brake lines routed and installed before any attempt to move the chassis.

With that in mind, I took a day off to prep for the flipping the caliper brackets. Pulling the rear axles sucked, as I had just put new differential oil into the rear end and now I was going to have to drain it all out. I thought about trying to capture it and reuse it, but I had no simple way to ensure it wouldn’t get contaminated and end up ruining my gears.

I got started by pulling the wheels off and then dropping the panhard bar so I could get to the differential cover. Since it seems that I’d put the panhard bar on the wrong way, that turned out to be beneficial. I popped the cover, setting it aside with its gasket. Then I pulled the retaining pin bolt and the retaining pin. Based on the videos I watched, the c-clips that held the axles in should have slid out easily.

That turned out to not be the case. The rotors were hitting the splash shield brackets and that tiny amount of interference was enough to keep the axles from traveling far enough into the pumpkin to free up the c-clips. Whether the rotors were warped to the point where they caused the contact or the brackets weren’t the proper size for those rotors is unclear. Maybe a bit of both?

It didn’t really matter to me as I pulled out the sawzall. I won’t be purposefully driving in the rain, so I don’t need splash shields. I did want to get this rear end project finished so that the boys and I could start building again on Sunday. I try to absorb as much of the rework stuff as possible. They enjoy building the car, but also bring a fair amount of teenage attitude to the garage depending on how their week has gone. And the build still leaves plenty of opportunities for me to demonstrate patience in the face of obstacles and/or problems. I’ll also admit to sometimes needing to focus on a difficult aspect without the distraction of teaching and parenting.

With the shield tabs out of the way the axles pushed into the pumpkin far enough to remove the c-clips. I pulled each axle and then pulled the caliper mounting brackets off and switched them side-to-side on the car, which allowed me to flip them back to front on each axle frame. I put each axle back in, then the c-clips, then the retaining pin, and the retaining bolt for the retaining pin. Progress!

As it happens, I was so focused on fixing the problem with the shield tabs – and by fixing, I mean cutting the problem off with a large power tool – I neglected to move the differential cover to where it wouldn’t get coated in steel dust. Whoops, not as focused as I should have been even without the kids there. Brake cleaner got the cover clean, but I didn’t trust that I could get the gasket clean. The gasket and my peace of mind was only $10, so that was an easy decision.

Everything got buttoned up and torqued down without destroying the new diff cover. With that fixed, we started working on the brake lines on Sunday. Next on the punch list, fabricating a bracket to mount the reservoirs and mapping out and bending all the brake lines.

Thanks to Jeff for pointing me the right way on this and egchewy, who's build post was briefly hijacked to discuss this mess.

Foster
 

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#47 ·
I saw no easy way to get the rotor off. No wiggle, no gaps, rear end was bought used and sitting somewhere for some decades. I guess I could have pounded away on them until they popped off, but that strikes me as a path to buying new rotors (which may happen anyway if they turn out to be warped). Now, in hindsight, the rotors are a wear item and thus have to come off for replacement. Lesson learned, I'll do more research next time.

Further research suggests this probably would have worked -

At least I'll be ready if I have to replace the rear rotors.

As for draining the oil, my drain pan was already filthy, so I was setting myself up to either clean that or purchase another. Then, once collected, purchase an additional means of getting the oil out of that container and back into the rear end. Two new bottles of oil<time+new container+pump & tubing.

Foster
 
#50 ·
To be 100% sure the cover gasket doesn't leak I follow this procedure; hold the gasket up in front of you, one hand at each corner, fold the gasket in half, you'll have something resembling a C, now fold that again, it'll sorta look like a coma. There, you're done, now throw it in the trash and use a good RTV. Hope that helps. >:)
 
#51 ·
Hi all,

It’s been a long time since I posted. I’m still working on my build and it doesn’t just feel like I’ve had to do everything twice, sometimes I’ve had to do them three times.

Just one example: Way back in Oct 2019 (post #39) I ran into my first issue with the rear diff, breaking off the two support bolts and leading to replacing the diff cover entirely. It had been sitting happily and not leaking for the better part of two years. And then my build reached the point where I could install the driveshaft.

The day after I installed the driveshaft and driveshaft safety loop there was a puddle of diff oil under the car. What? Research suggested a failed pinion seal. I ordered a kit and rented a flange puller. Took the safety loop and the driveshaft off and went to pull the flange (I figured enough of the oil had drained at this point). I had gotten the puller lined up and tightened down just enough to hold its own weight when the flange popped off. Interesting. Maybe the pinion seal was fine. I decided to confirm that by removing it – I had the replacement. Sure enough, the diff started to drain more oil with the seal removed.

Ok, that confirmed that the seal was fine, which mean the flange wasn’t set right or had been dinged while the rear end sat around at the scrap yard. Either way, I figured that called for a new flange and so back to the Ford part department to place another order. As of November 2022, the new flange was in, the diff refilled with oil, and the driveshaft and safety loop reinstalled. Just a short 30 or so days of not making any progress to sort that out. Lots of the build has been like that, which leads me to my current challenge.

I have lost faith in the used MassFlo kit I picked up at the start of my build. During my engine rebuild the builder discovered that the distributor was burned out, so we replaced it. Well, the connector on the new one doesn’t match the connector on the MassFlo kit. Nor, looking back at the photos, did it match the old, burned out distributor. And, one of the connectors on the throttle body was going to interfere with the mechanical throttle linkage. Toss in the massive challenge in installing the mass flow sensor into the air filter body (I ended up ordering a taller filter just to try and buy some more room), some discovered bits of missing wire insulation, and a general feeling that more gremlins were lingering, I decided to sidestep the entire mess.

So, I pulled the wiring and computer from the car and will post it on the parts board at some point. I suspect there may be some hard to find bits in there that might help someone looking for replacements for their MassFlo. Which leads me to the point of this post. I’d love some feedback on the component set up I’ve pulled together and if there’s anything I’ve overlooked. Based on what I’ve read, these should all fit onto my block and work together, but while I don’t have any noticeable facial tics, my build is a stovetop that continues to burn me even when I think it’s cooled off. 😊

Block – Ford 302 stroked out to 331 (turns out those cylinder walls were past repair). Big thanks to Tim’s Speed & Custom Tim's Speed and Custom and Kingsley Automotive Machine Kingsley Automotive Machine for the rebuild.

This is the new distributor – Part #8456 – I know this works because the engine was broken in by the builder. MSD 8456 Ford 5.0L Pro-Billet Distributor

I figure this intake manifold will fit and that the Holley Sniper will fit on top of it - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/wnd-8124wnd/make/ford/model/mustang/year/1987

This is the Sniper I’m looking at - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sne-550-511

Also, the page on Summit states this is a required part – true or not? https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hly-558-493

I’d appreciate any help and insight you guys might have. I knew this was a marathon and not a sprint when I started. Looking forward to getting over this current hurdle and making progress towards that first start. Thanks in advance.

Foster

 
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