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post #1 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 07:47 PM Thread Starter
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Icon21 Exhaust too loud, any suggestions?

This weekend I put about 100 miles on my car, (about 300 total) and my left ear was abused by the sound from the side pipes. Not too bad, but not comfortable. I can not really carry a conversation while cruising.
I thought it would be quieter than this with my setup.

What I have:
MK III
5.0 with Eldelbrock cam and heads
Cats
FFR side pipes (4 bolt)
EFI

I do not want to cut my exhaust.
I do not have a welder.
My headers and pipes are ceramic coated, thus no cutting or welding for me.

I was thinking about these:

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCI-3DI25R/



(Copied these from the instruction sheet.)

3. The insert must be secured in the tube. Either weld,
bolt using a minimum of a ľ” long through bolt or pop
rivet, using at least 3/16” stainless steel rivets. DO

NOT use screws as they may vibrate loose.

#3: On cars equipped with catalytic converters DO NOT install inserts
ahead of the converter. Always install the inserts after the catalytic
converter.

#5: On street applications always install the insert in the pipe BEFORE the
pipe goes over the axle. DO NOT install in the tail pipe. The reason is that
the inserts are less effective at reducing overall sound the further back they
are installed.

If you are using the insert in conjunction with an existing

muffler, installation in the tail pipe will be fine.

The diameter of the above is 3.0".
What is the diameter needed to install this in the tailpipe section?
According to the instructions, these can be installed in the tail pipe (End section of the exhaust, just under the door. (Am I reading this wrong?)

I am planing on keeping them in place with long SS rivets.
(Any suggestions here? Will the screws vibrate free?)

I have searched this topic, just looking for specific answers to my needs.

I am not worried about a slight loss in power (that might be an issue later on, when I am more used to the car, but not yet).

Please no negative replies. i.e. These cars are meant to be loud, you are a girlie man etc.

I like to take my kids for rides (7 & 6 years old) and I would like for them to be able to hear me latter on in life. Also being able to talk while cruising would be nice.

No, I will not wear ear plugs.

Any better suggestions, that follow my above criteria?

Thank you all for your inputs. I love my car!!!!



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post #2 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 07:53 PM
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But you are a girlie man! just joking.(someone would end up saying it) What about Gas-N pipes? Good of you for caring bout your hearing.
I've never heard about that product, but wouldn't silicone hold it in place?


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post #3 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 07:58 PM
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I have Gas-N pipes and unfortunantly I don't think thay are much quieter. Just a different sound.
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post #4 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 08:00 PM
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Well if you have money burning a hole in your pocket you could check these out by breeze.

Otherwise do a search on baffles, I have seen a lot here using standard things from HD and other hardware stores such as sink strainers and what not...

Chris P.

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post #5 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 08:01 PM Thread Starter
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Silicone might be an issue!!! Maybe not....

Chris,
if the ones I have posted above will work, I really do not want to reinvent the wheel. With parts, time etc. they will not be that off the purchase price.

Oh, no money burning holes in my pants!!! Unfortunately....


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post #6 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 08:05 PM
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Silicone can hold pretty good. if you ever need to take them out, just pull them out. Scrape off the silicone. Wham! back to stock. Of course, do testing to see if it wiggles lose.

-Joe
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post #7 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 08:14 PM Thread Starter
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Joe,
what type of silicone would hold in these temps?
I am thinking that regular GE wont hold, hight temp silicone right? Like RTV stuff?
Maybe a stupid question, but then again, I am no expert.

Now about those inserts....


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post #8 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 08:15 PM
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With no earplugs, you would probably need undercar exhaust. Then you would just lose hearing from wind noise. I have cats and better after market side pipes and my car is relatively quiet. At 60 mph, the wind noise is louder than the exhaust. I tried those inserts you reference between the cats and the ffr glass packs. I think you will find them a waste of money. I took one out and could not tell the difference in sound from one side to the other. I have a 5.0 fuel injected with an e303 cam.

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post #9 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 08:21 PM
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IF you don't mind the cost, apparently quietpipes by breeze might be your best bet. About the silicone, I hadn't thought about the temps. Just the vibrations. Yes, RTV silicone should do. It can handle over 600 degrees F. If your pipes get that hot, sound is not your major issue.
This should do...
http://www.acehardware.com/product/i...554&cp=1259010

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post #10 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 08:32 PM
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I don't think you will make much difference without a major change.

Most people have found little real change with inserts after the muffler. Several threads here with different approaches. Part of the problem is the quality of the sound from the glass packs. Has a good deal of high frequency "bark" which is hard on the ears. Remember too it will get louder as the glass pack blows out.

I went with cc inserts, stainless steel wool packing in front of auger type 24" mufflers. Requires cutting/rewelding and recoating. Gives a slight reduction in the overall noise but also removes the harsh high end frequencies.

Consider that if you can't stand the sound you are not going to enjoy the car.

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post #11 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 08:51 PM
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Or, you could just keep your "no ear plugs" strategy, and eventually, it won't be an issue. I posted a while back about a study they did on convertible drivers and long term hearing loss. It's a big deal man, seriously. My daughter is deaf in one ear, so I'm a little hypersensitive, but ear plugs are in line with seat belts in these cars, no matter what exhaust you're running.

We live in a rural area, and there are way too many under 40 half deaf (and more over 40 who are fully deaf) farmers out here because they are stubborn about hearing protection.

Soapbox ended on that, my .02.

If you really don't like the sound, though, I agree that under car is going to be your best option.

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post #12 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 08:56 PM
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post #13 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 09:03 PM
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No, I will not wear ear plugs/

Then welcome to Tinnitusville. Even if you had a had full undercar exhaust you should wear at least a plug in your left ear. The wind noise alone is enough to damage your hearing.

I'd have finished a long time ago if I knew they were this fun!


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post #14 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 09:03 PM Thread Starter
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I would love to have the Breeze quite pipes, but no budget as of now. In the not too far future thought, they will be. I was wondering about the inserts as a temporary fix until that time comes.

I forgot to mention, that I have an APE hard top with side windows that do reduce the sound a bit and the wind noise etc. obviously is almost non existent.
I was surprised at the lack of "boominess" as well.

The reason why I do not like ear plugs, is that I can't drive with out being fully aware of my surroundings. I need to be able to hear everything to drive safely. Not an anti ear plug deal, just how I can do it safer.

I will keep on searching for more ideas and please keep the ideas on how I can reduce the noise with what I have coming.

I do not want to cut my exhaust.
I do not have a welder.
My headers and pipes are ceramic coated, thus no cutting or welding for me.

I am sure someone out there has done something about this, with the above requirements.


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post #15 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 09:05 PM
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I am hoping someone posts something that really reduces the side pipe noise.
I use ear plugs and my car it is also too loud.....
That is my mission for next year to get it down to as close to no sound as possible....

I am concidering anything new mufflers, inserts etc......

ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
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post #16 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 09:07 PM Thread Starter
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Come on guys, you know I love you all, but any one has an answer to my original post?

I am not trying to start a dispute about the loudness and how cool or fast of whatever like that one Canadian guy....


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post #17 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 09:08 PM
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Cobra 302, look at quietpipes by breeze. That, and maybe Classic Chambered.

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post #18 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 09:10 PM
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Silicon Batutub caulk (flesh colored) in your ears will do the trick!!

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post #19 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 09:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cobrathegreat View Post
The reason why I do not like ear plugs, is that I can't drive with out being fully aware of my surroundings. I need to be able to hear everything to drive safely. Not an anti ear plug deal, just how I can do it safer.
If you go beyond the foam orange ones, there are lots of options with various reduction (db) ratings. A good set of custom ($80-100) ear plugs make all the difference in the world.

Along with what you're doing on your pipes, I'd suggest you take a visit to the local hearing center, they'll have a myriad of options available.

Kevin Davis (KD)
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post #20 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 09:23 PM
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Quiet exhaust

I wanted quieter exhaust and tried the FFR sidepipes with supplied j-pipe - too harsh and loud! I then substituted catalytic converters and it was much better. I then added Gas'n perfect polished stainless side pipes, and they were even better, by about 40%. These beautiful pipes are packed with stainless steel wool and glass to provide a lifetime of muffled sound with just the right exhaust note. I have had them on for two years and can vouch for them. They are also one of our vendors.
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post #21 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 09:31 PM
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I use a stereo Ipod
since a stereo in the dash is a waste of time , this is killing two birds

You can buy an offroad head phone package that plays music then cuts off when someone talk$ (passenger)

Better than restricting your exhaust

Toyota makes a thing called a Prius , but I hear it is slower

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post #22 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 09:34 PM
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I have a 4.6L with a 4-into-1 manifold followed by cats and then into the FFR sidepipes; still too loud for more than 30min driving on the highway. I can tell you that it's really the wind more than anything else that beats on your left ear, until you step on the loud pedal and then it's a double-whammy.

I'm not sure I understand the reluctance to wear earplugs. When I'm parked they hang off the rear-view mirror to let "them" know that this is a seriously loud machine. I have a slight hearing loss and I want to keep what's left to listen to the softer noises in life. Like leafs rustling or birds in the distance...

As far as "being totally aware" without earplugs, let me ask a question: do you drive a sedan with all windows down, just to be fully aware? Yet the effect of rolled up windows is the same as muffling the noise at the ear canal. How about a panoramic clip-on mirror instead? I got one of those and it does a heck of a lot more for awareness than hearing what's around.


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post #23 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 09:37 PM
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Sam,

I have the GasN Pipes and love the sound. I know they are expensive and from what you say they are louder than you want. When I talked to Georgie at GasN, he told me that the FFR's were the loudest, followed by the GasN's he sold, then the quiet pipes were quieter yet. Also from what you infer, cost is an object but I don't know of an option that doesn't involve cutting your pipes apart.

Before I bought my GasN Pipes, I was in the same position as you and didn't want to spend the money for new pipes, just make the stock ones better. I went to my exhaust guy and he suggested I have him cut them open (they weren't coated yet) and insert some SS vortex cones from Summit. He suggested the inserts go at the front of the muffler. Thats what I did but when he welded them up and I had them coated and installed on my car,I discovered he screwed them up, they weren't aimed the same, one was aimed up. He said he would refund my money or redo them for free but the ceramic coater wanted another $200 to recoat the one pipe. I never heard them run, just said screw it, took the refund, then bought the GasN Pipes.

If you have interest in my pipes, I would make you a smoking deal and you would only have to fix one. I believe the cones cost me around $125.

Good luck

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post #24 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 10:02 PM Thread Starter
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Gents,
I have done some forum searching and some soul searching.
I decided I will order the inserts posted above and see if they help.
I have posted the 3" inserts, but I believe I need the 2.5" to be inserted in the cats. (corrected above)
Can anyone tell me which size I need for sure? I can measure, but I am not home yet.

OK, OK.....in long trips I will have an ear plug for my left ear.

If none of the above help, I will get the quiet pipe retrofit from Breeze.

Bob, thanks for the offer. I will pass for now, just to see if th inserts help. But, I might give send you a PM later on...

Magnus,
not trying to be a smart Aleck. I am just stating my driving style.
I knew that people would disagree with my comment about no ear plugs and being aware of my surroundings but I just like it that way.
I have convex mirrors which help. Oh, I do not drive a sedan. My daily driver is a BMW Mcoupe and I drive with the Dr. side window down 95% of the time. (5% is when raining-rare in SoCal- and when to cold-rare in SoCal).
I am 36 years old and have no accidents in the past 15 years.

I just found out that MARIAH used the inserts with good results.

So, back to the ORIGINAL SUBJECT please.
What size do I need, and where do I insert them from on a cat. conv.

I WILL BUY EARPLUGS TODAY, and I will try to save my hearing. That subject is closed!!!


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post #25 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 10:53 PM
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I've got the std FFR side pipes and a 3.27:1 axle ratio. Can cruise at 65mph (1800 rpm in 5th gear) and the exhaust is not loud. However, the wind noise is extremely loud. If you have a big rear end gear, you might want to reduce down one or two sizes. Each axle ratio drop will reduce your rpm about 200 when going at the same speed. I wear ear plugs if going very far due to wind noise.

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post #26 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 11:01 PM
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Talking

These will work if you can get a size that slides into your header system ahead of the mufflers. They are designed for open headers and you only need to anchor them if they blow out of the open collector. Your side pipe with the glass packs will keep them from sliding out. Try them and if they slide in ahead of the mufflers pack the spaces between each disk with stainless steel scratch pads. The scratch pads are a used by most cooks for cleaning pots and pans and are available at any store that has kitchen equipment. They will add a bit of restriction to your exhaust and the ones I have in my old Auto-X Corvette came with a cap with a hole it it you can attach to the back end of the center tube to force the exhaust back up and through the insert try it with out the cap and pop rivit (SS)this on if needed. If you have a loose fit as you slide them in bend the lip on each end at 3 or 4 places till it fits . Just checked my JEGS catalog (WWW.JEGS.COM or 1-800-345-4545) and they are called Collector inserts made by car chemistry. All are 7in long and come in 2 and 3 disc configurations (the 3 disc would be better if you want to fill the spaces with SS). They list 2 1/2, 3, 3 1/2 for both.
HTH
CB
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post #27 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 11:02 PM
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I was at a local gun show a couple weeks ago and saw the guy that makes custom fit plugs. I've never paid much attention to him, because I didn't need new shooting plugs. But out of curiosity I stopped by his table. I didn't have enough cash on me at that show (other purchases) but I'm going to have hi make me a set of custom fitted plugs. They will be flesh tone and have that technology that they block out certain dBs but amplifies normal conversation. The plugs alone will kill the wind noise, conversation will be amplified, and the bark of the pipes will be blocked (I hope).

I'll let you know how they work in the spring
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post #28 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 11:09 PM Thread Starter
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Randal,
I have 3.55, so that should not be as bad. I wan to reduce noise in all speeds.

CB,
thank you for the info. I will insert them as they are, then add SS and see the difference in dB as well as power.
Thanks for the reply.

Joe,
let us know how they work.
Thanks


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FFR5922 MK3(Ordered 12/19/06 Arrived 2/7/07)
5.0 EFI W/ Edelbrock Performer Heads/Cam, BBK SSI Intake, T-5 W/ Midshift, 3-Link, ABS.
First Start 2/7/08

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post #29 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 11:37 PM
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Simple solution: Under car exhaust..

FFR 6639 3.1 Complete kit received 11/28/08, 1965 289 stroked to 347, custom undercar exhaust inside frame, 3 link, tko-600 , ebrake mod, heater w/fresh air intake, Corbeau LG-1 seats, custom vinyl interior. Registered 6/10, 1st Racetrack 9/29/10 (limerock), first AutoX 10/10/10. Painted Corvette Velocity Yellow 4/11
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post #30 of 154 (permalink) Old 12-21-2009, 11:51 PM
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You could try this cheap and easy method to extend the glass-pack. It cuts down the noise and does't require taking the exhaust apart. Just add 7-8 inches of fiberglass pipe insulation to the turnout along with a piece of gutter screen and an end cap to hold it all in place. It has held up for over 3,000 miles on our MkIII Roadster.








FFR-5828, '93 GT donor, performer RPM heads, intake, cam, MSD 6AL, BG Demon 650RR, 3:55 gears, PSE 15" Halibrands, 3-link, Konis', viper red & wimbledon white.
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