Home repair guys: tile backer repair question

[Aaron Silidker]

Hello all!

In my shower at the house I bought the tile backer is soft around the diverter and the spigot near the tub. The tile is starting to sink inward away from the tub. The backer needs to be replaced along with some tile. I don't want to do a permanent repair because eventually I will be gutting and redoing the bathroom, I just want something that is temporary and somewhat decent looking....any ideas?

I only have one bathroom and shower (right now), so major renovations and repairs will have to wait until the basement bathroom (eventually) gets installed.

Thanks!

[rjjablo]

Its worse than you think behind there. Pull it out and you will be surprised at how far the water has migrated in the backer.

[Aaron Silidker]

Originally Posted by rjjablo

Its worse than you think behind there. Pull it out and you will be surprised at how far the water has migrated in the backer.

Any suggestions on what I can do to quickly repair it since I only have one bath/shower in my house? Plastic insert until the second bath is done so I can renovate this one? Possible to tear it out, replace, and tile in one day? I can shower with febreeze for a weekend if this repair is something I can do in a day or two.....

[crash]

This is kind of along the lines of someone asking what they can do to temperarily "fix" a rod knock! You could put gear lube in the engine, or some of those disolving lead pellets...our you can bite the bullet and fix it right. If you don't fix it right, you are likely to spend more money, and gauranteed more time, fixing it twice...or three times...or whatever.

rjj is right, if the backer board is failing, and it was the correct material to begin with, then there is likely MAJOR issues back there. The very minimum will be to pull that section out all the way to the floor, hopefully a concrete slab(?), and then redo it all. If studs are not damaged, then you, or an experienced tradesman, should be able to do this in a couple days time. Mainly the time issues will be with waiting for things to set/dry between processes. If I were you, the LAST thing I would do is ignore it any longer and say that you will get to it "someday". Water damage can be dreadfully expensive to fix when it is sustained for long periods of time.

[LesMurray]

Also, where there is water there could also be termites or carpenter ants.

[expat]

We had a rental with a similar condition
But we could get into it from the other side of the wall
All I did (until we tore it all out) was use that insulating spray foam to push out
The wet failing backer board. The amount to use was tricky
But it also gave some water proofing & it stuck like glue
When we did tear it out we replaced the studs etc as the damage was extensive
Good luck.

[Aaron Silidker]

Originally Posted by crash

This is kind of along the lines of someone asking what they can do to temperarily "fix" a rod knock! You could put gear lube in the engine, or some of those disolving lead pellets...our you can bite the bullet and fix it right. If you don't fix it right, you are likely to spend more money, and gauranteed more time, fixing it twice...or three times...or whatever.

rjj is right, if the backer board is failing, and it was the correct material to begin with, then there is likely MAJOR issues back there. The very minimum will be to pull that section out all the way to the floor, hopefully a concrete slab(?), and then redo it all. If studs are not damaged, then you, or an experienced tradesman, should be able to do this in a couple days time. Mainly the time issues will be with waiting for things to set/dry between processes. If I were you, the LAST thing I would do is ignore it any longer and say that you will get to it "someday". Water damage can be dreadfully expensive to fix when it is sustained for long periods of time.

I know there is/was major leak issues. From below in the basement and from the access panel, the studs and framing are dry and there are no internal leaks. The water damage is either due to crappy grout or an old leak.

The house was built in 1962 and judging by the plumbing and the iron tub, this is likely original.

I need to mitigate the damage for now until I have time/a second shower to do the complete gut which was already planned.

I guess if there is no "accepted" way to perform a temporary repair, I will summon my best redneck skills and tackle it this weekend with some redneck engineering. Sheet metal, glue, tiles of the same size, and grout should give me a shower wall that isn't soft to the touch.

[Brian F]

You could buy an FRP (fiberglass reinforced panel) panel and put it over the tiles. Cut holes for fixtures etc, and caulk seams and edges.

But, sorta like tossing a dead fish in a hole in a wall and covering the hole with a picture and hoping it doesn't start to smell.

[BigLeo69]

Originally Posted by Aaron Silidker

Hello all!

In my shower at the house I bought the tile backer is soft around the diverter and the spigot near the tub. The tile is starting to sink inward away from the tub. The backer needs to be replaced along with some tile. I don't want to do a permanent repair because eventually I will be gutting and redoing the bathroom, I just want something that is temporary and somewhat decent looking....any ideas?

I only have one bathroom and shower (right now), so major renovations and repairs will have to wait until the basement bathroom (eventually) gets installed.

Thanks!

first find the leak, the diverter gasket may be bad, the shower head maybe leaking down behind too. if you have a basement check the floor area below.

older houses: tile may of been in a mudset, thats a plaster or masonry wall with tile set into it. very tough wall but gets compromised by water leaks.
other installs early were green board (MR) drywall, this too works good for awhile but if water gets past the tile grout and seals are broke it falls apart along with it getting mold into it.
you could do a quick fix, for now. but one bathroom can create havoc on a household if you gut it.
if you do have a basement may i suggest one there first then gut the other.

good luck

[Aaron Silidker]

Originally Posted by expat

We had a rental with a similar condition
But we could get into it from the other side of the wall
All I did (until we tore it all out) was use that insulating spray foam to push out
The wet failing backer board. The amount to use was tricky
But it also gave some water proofing & it stuck like glue
When we did tear it out we replaced the studs etc as the damage was extensive
Good luck.

I have access to the back. I was planning a complete gut once the basement bathroom is done (eventually).

Originally Posted by BigLeo69

first find the leak, the diverter gasket may be bad, the shower head maybe leaking down behind too. if you have a basement check the floor area below.

older houses: tile may of been in a mudset, thats a plaster or masonry wall with tile set into it. very tough wall but gets compromised by water leaks.
other installs early were green board (MR) drywall, this too works good for awhile but if water gets past the tile grout and seals are broke it falls apart along with it getting mold into it.
you could do a quick fix, for now. but one bathroom can create havoc on a household if you gut it.
if you do have a basement may i suggest one there first then gut the other.

good luck

I am planning a basement bathroom once I learn about it and plan it out thoroughly. Until then, I need to get this to hold together! There is no leaking behind or below (anymore?). I just replaced the diverter and once I can get the water off (seized screw style shut offs ), I will replace the hot and cold valves.


THE FUN OF HOME OWNERSHIP!

Thank the mechanical gods that I was blessed with hands-on ability to tackle this stuff myself. I can't imagine being prey for repair folks with zero knowledge like most people.....

[rjjablo]

Put a stool in the basment on the drain where your new bathroom is going to be. Walls are unimportant

Shower head over a drain in the basement floor. Curtain is optional. Floor in basement is not that cold in the winter. Or flip flops at Target.

Your a bachelor Right?

Don't invite anyone over until your are done with upstairs Bathroom.

[Cobra Cory]

Ummm...yeah. I had the same issue in a bathroom here at work. Sort of. I wound up taking half the wall out due to the studs being all soggy and moldy. If you have water getting into your walls you're going to have mold in there which is BAD! I like the FRP idea. You could just stick it on with some liquid nails or something if the problem is only at the fixtures and caulk the openings really well until you can get in there and tear it all apart. But it aint no one day project if done correctly. We just got an estimate for almost $2,000 to do a tiled ADA shower at work. I know tile is nice, but what a maintenance-pain-in-the-arse.

[Terrorist Hunter]

It'll be worth your time to do it once and do it right, even if it takes a weekend or two and you have to get a cheap-o hotel room for a place to stay. Old cast iron tubs are awesome and not so cheap/easy to find anymore so if you're not going to keep it, it may be worth just a few bucks to somebody. A good tile saw is worth the money if you don't have one by the way...

[CapeCoralCobra]

It sounds like you have a tub/shower combo. You can still use the tub for a bath after you remove the shower walls. Tear out the wall, locate the leak, if you have one - could just be from many years of small amounts of water getting into the wall at the diverter, shower head, or faucet - and repair any structural damage. I've been doing tile work off & on for 20 years and have replaced many shower enclosures backed by green board & similar products - crumbling moldy walls, rotted framing, soaked insulation, dead rodents, you name it. If you're going to do tile again, use Durock or a similar cement board backer. Working with it is simiar to drywall/green board, but water doesn't affect it. Some guys use a cement blade on a circular saw to cut it. I typically just use a razor knife, just like cutting drywall. I go through quite a few blades, but makes for a whole lot less dust.

[Aaron Silidker]

Originally Posted by expat

We had a rental with a similar condition
But we could get into it from the other side of the wall
All I did (until we tore it all out) was use that insulating spray foam to push out
The wet failing backer board. The amount to use was tricky
But it also gave some water proofing & it stuck like glue
When we did tear it out we replaced the studs etc as the damage was extensive
Good luck.

Originally Posted by BigLeo69

first find the leak, the diverter gasket may be bad, the shower head maybe leaking down behind too. if you have a basement check the floor area below.

older houses: tile may of been in a mudset, thats a plaster or masonry wall with tile set into it. very tough wall but gets compromised by water leaks.
other installs early were green board (MR) drywall, this too works good for awhile but if water gets past the tile grout and seals are broke it falls apart along with it getting mold into it.
you could do a quick fix, for now. but one bathroom can create havoc on a household if you gut it.
if you do have a basement may i suggest one there first then gut the other.

good luck

Originally Posted by rjjablo

Put a stool in the basment on the drain where your new bathroom is going to be. Walls are unimportant

Shower head over a drain in the basement floor. Curtain is optional. Floor in basement is not that cold in the winter. Or flip flops at Target.

Your a bachelor Right?

Don't invite anyone over until your are done with upstairs Bathroom.

It is almost winter in Michigan...but, if my basement floor drain can handle it, I guess a ghetto shower setup will work for a few weeks. Great idea to consider.

Originally Posted by Terrorist Hunter

It'll be worth your time to do it once and do it right, even if it takes a weekend or two and you have to get a cheap-o hotel room for a place to stay. Old cast iron tubs are awesome and not so cheap/easy to find anymore so if you're not going to keep it, it may be worth just a few bucks to somebody. A good tile saw is worth the money if you don't have one by the way...

I don't plan on replacing the tub. It works, it is solid, and it is there. I will leave it! Just want to do new floors, toilet, vanity, add a bathroom vent, wall coverings, and that's about it. I guess that is more of a facelift?

Originally Posted by CapeCoralCobra

It sounds like you have a tub/shower combo. You can still use the tub for a bath after you remove the shower walls. Tear out the wall, locate the leak, if you have one - could just be from many years of small amounts of water getting into the wall at the diverter, shower head, or faucet - and repair any structural damage. I've been doing tile work off & on for 20 years and have replaced many shower enclosures backed by green board & similar products - crumbling moldy walls, rotted framing, soaked insulation, dead rodents, you name it. If you're going to do tile again, use Durock or a similar cement board backer. Working with it is simiar to drywall/green board, but water doesn't affect it. Some guys use a cement blade on a circular saw to cut it. I typically just use a razor knife, just like cutting drywall. I go through quite a few blades, but makes for a whole lot less dust.

Great idea! I forget that I can use it as a tub...haven't taken a bath in years but for a few weeks or so while I renovate, it won't be an issue. I can also shower at work. Inconvenient, but it will work!

I will work on something really temporary this weekend...like the fiberglass idea, and will start to plan my permanent attack.

[cobrathegreat]

You can get a shower wand that attaches to the shower head and use it as a shower, while you cover the damaged area with a large trash bag while you are tearing it apart. That way you can still take a shower and move on with the repair. Just an idea.

Safe Home Modifications

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Waterpik-E...Chrome/5740916

[NiceGuyEddie]

happened to me too, I used an 18 x 18 tile, big enough so the edges would be on a flat part of the shower wall. held it in place with silicone for 18 months.

then, when you do your remodel, plan in advance that the rot behind the shower is probably pretty bad.

cheers,

[DMW]

If you are going to gut it anyway in the near future, I would just get a fiberglass surround to cover the entire shower area. And if you are doing that, then you might as well rip out the plumbing wall to see what damage you can find. You can then fix what is needed and overlay with the fiberglass surround. I don't remember what those surrounds cost but you might be able to find a cheap one or a really good one that will be part of your new bath eventually so it would be no money wasted.

We've had many, many houses and I just prefer fiberglass showers and surrounds. The tile looks great but they all seem to leak eventually.

[Mike Wilson]

private message sent.

[expat]

Originally Posted by DMW

If you are going to gut it anyway in the near future, I would just get a fiberglass surround to cover the entire shower area. And if you are doing that, then you might as well rip out the plumbing wall to see what damage you can find. You can then fix what is needed and overlay with the fiberglass surround. I don't remember what those surrounds cost but you might be able to find a cheap one or a really good one that will be part of your new bath eventually so it would be no money wasted.

We've had many, many houses and I just prefer fiberglass showers and surrounds. The tile looks great but they all seem to leak eventually.

that reminded me of another idea
my ghetto rental buddy buys a piece of linoleum & literally glues it like a piece of flexible tub surround to cover all the walls the water will hit
Its an amazing quick fix & some are still up after several years.....