So my nephew is planning on going to Don Bosco in the fall which is a Catholic High School here in NorthernNJ. They have a pretty good football program for where we are in the country. LOL
Since they don't live close to the school they come over to our house everyday. He was telling me about practice and how the coaches don't let them have any water breaks during the entire practice. Like much of the US lately, it has been pretty hot and humid here.
Then you read articles like this one: Families of Athletes to Sue Over Heat-Related Deaths
Granted both the players that died had conditions unknown by the parents that contributed to their deaths which made them more susceptible to the heat.
Not sure I have a question here, but not sure the risk is worth the reward. Wondering how much training these coaches get on this topic, as they must be aware of the dangers. Or do we just mark this up as, that's life bad stuff can happen, so suck it up.
For any of the coaches out there, does no water break build character or make them that much stronger? I guess it works since they have a pretty good program.
I am all for working hard and the best should win and not everyone gets a trophy and those that work the hardest should be rewarded by wining.
If it's true, it's both stupid and abusive. In my work with public schools, I regularly train coaches that kids can have as much as they want to drink, any time they want it. Any other policy makes no sense and is a potential recipe for perfectly avoidable disaster.
FFR1004105RD - world's first twin-turbo BMW V12-powered FFR Roadster
2011 Dodge 2500 Cummins 6.7L - biodiesel-fueled daily driver JHETTO: 2001 VW Jetta TDI, intended as G3F donor, FOR SALE
I played HS football here in AZ and we got 2-3 water breaks over 2 hours. This was while wearing helmets and pads in 100+ temps. The water came from fountains about 100 yards off the practice field and if you weren't fast enough getting there sometimes you didn't make it to the front of the line before they called you back. It was #*@&ing brutal and very stupid. A few years after I graduated a kid died during practice due to dehydration so now they have water on the field.
Here's the clipping. Same coach I had and he and the entire dept. should have been sued if not indicted for negligent homicide.
Not allowing water is just about the dumbest thing coaches can do. If it is true he needs confronted by parents and the board.
When we played football and soccer, we had tables set up all over the place around the field packed with sport bottles full of water. If you needed water, you ran your ass to the closest one and picked one up before the next play. Never had a line for water since everyone went at different times and never had anyone get sick from heat.
In almost every case I see regarding these situations the child as another condition that factors in to the death. I know everything is not detectable but maybe they should go back to making physicals mandatory for sports. I know some parts around here a parent can opt the child out of it because it's to "uncomfortable" for the child.
FFR# 6281: 351w, Vic Jr. heads, 10.5:1, xe288hr cam. IRS.
First start: Nov. 08
First go gart: Nov. 08
I understand the set time for water breaks. Without it, depending upon the age and maturity of the kid it can be very disruptive to training. On the other hand, NO WATER BREAKS, is just asking for trouble.
The best thing to do is go watch a practice. If what your being told is true the coach needs to be either trained or replaced. I assisted as medical support for my sons football team (first response emergency stuff) I missed a game due to a wedding; had my brother go to watch my son play. Wicked hot and sure enough he and three other got heat stroke.
Found out afterwards no available shade and limited water it was humid and mid-90's. Coach and I had a "meeting" and after that we had more water than players. Simpy no need for that stupidity.
These cars have the unique ability to turn otherwise sane, sober, mature and responsible citizens into the most amusing group of drooling, speed hungry, burn-out juvenile delinquent gear heads I have ever known; my kindred spirits!
You should be concerned. Go to the NOAA website to see the heat index chart: National Weather Service Heat Safety It takes relative humidity into consideration and displays the actual heat. Easy to read. Next, take that info to the principal in charge of the school (since it's private) and ask "May I see your policy for after school sports and adverse weather conditions?" Public schools have to have them. You may get a blank look. It's an opportunity to discuss concerns. Exertional activity can be well tolerated IF the person is well hydrated both before and after an event. What is most important to hear from them is that the coach DOES know the signs and symptoms of heat exhaustion and can recognize them, well before it becomes heat stroke (when the body is no longer perspiring to control temperature.) Go to the NATA (National Athletic Trainer's Association) to see some credible guidelines that the coach should respect and may be aware of. Here is a quote from the CDC about this problem "Coaches should continue to stress to their athletes the importance of maintaining the proper hydration before, during and after sports activities."
If you have any questions, send me a PM.
If it weren't for physics and law enforcement...I'd be unstoppable!
Man, that is so old school. The thinking is it will make you "tougher" and better conditioned blah blah. What you get is some brain damaged or dead kids. How old is this coach? Thought all of those dinosaurs were gone.
It's finally here. FFR 4017 MKII
As AGL302 said, GO WATCH A PRACTICE. If you really want to know the truth, go and watch a few practices and try to stay out of sight of the coach. A bad coach with any brains will suddenly coach better if he /she knows a parent is watching. So make sure the coach doesn't know. Then if there is an issue, you can water board him for it. Figuratively speaking of course. Having a camera to videotape the practice is a good idea if there is an issue, then you can submit the video to your state athletics association. Forcing kids to go without water breaks will cost him his job and could even get him banned from coaching. Too many deaths and lawsuits have resulted over this issue and it is taken very seriously. I believe coaches are encouraged to have mandatory water breaks now in order to avoid it. I remember reading an article where a NFL team put some sort of monitor on their players to actively track their temps during summer practices, I think it was the Vikings.
"Autoholism: An incurable addiction medicated daily with car porn."
"It's loud, smells like gasoline, and shakes, shudders, and bucks. It makes your arms tired and your feet hot. You nearly crash about once every ten minutes. It's so damn wonderful you can’t believe it." -Automobile Mag. Oct. '04
I went to HS in Louisiana, summer football training was in full pads and lasted about two hours. The temps were usually 90º to 100º, with the humidity around 90% to 100%. We got a water, one 6½oz Coke bottle full at the half way point. Everyone would get "cotton mouth" so bad we couldn't hardly talk. Fortunately, no one ever fell out or was injured. Our coach had a very successful career, coaching HS and collage teams at Northwestern State University in Louisiana until his retirement.
I remember in high school wrestling practice (early 1970's) hearing "Water is for fish" if someone wanted to take a water break (calling a wrestler a fish was an insult-- they just flop around).
More than about 2% drop in body weight from sweat and you're starting to cook, 3% your performance is falling off. If the coach thinks he's toughening up the players, he's really doing the opposite and putting them at risk.
The problem is that during exercise, you typically don't feel a sensation of thirst until after you've lost 1–2% of your body weight as fluid. That equates to 1.5–3.0 lbs. of fluid for a 150-lb athlete (0.68–1.36 kg for a 68-kg athlete). With that amount of fluid loss, you're already in the throes of dehydration; your body's ability to cool itself is undermined because dehydration results in decreased blood flow to the skin and a lower sweat rate. Thus, both mechanisms for thermoregulation are compromised when you're running low on fluids.
We make the kids doing swimming training keep full water bottles. As you can dehydrate Training in the pool.
Dumb dumb and dumber, if true.
Water is hydroscopic, so being in water can pull water out of your body.
I can't believe this old wive's tail about not drinking water during hard workouts is still around in 2012. I remember how we were told it would give you stomach cramps etc. What a load of crap that turned out to be.
You've got to find out how true this is and get it corrected before someone's kid pays for a coach's misinformation. Well-intentioned or not.
3733k Stock 5.0, 3:55 gears, 15" Halibrands, '91 donor, Tremec 3550. "Arrest Me" Yellow / Black Stripes.
My car: a lightweight, precision-guided, sledgehammer.
Chris, as others have said, its crazy to me that there are still coaches around like that, especially after just reading an artical about the new rules at NFL Camps. I would say what he is saying needs to be verified and if its true the parents need to step in.
MKIII Roadster #5835; IRS, Team III Wheels, Kuhmo XS Tires
Anderson Performance 408 Engine; Levy T5 Transmission
Engine Installed July 4th, First start July 5th 2009
Metal Morphous paint completed on November 20th
On the Road July 2011
I enrolled Damon in a beginner tennis camp this summer, he went with a neighbor boy. After a couple days of horror stories about lack of water breaks, and multiple laps around the whole complex as punishment for being too slow collecting the balls when asked, the other dad and I decided to go watch.
It was just as bad as the boys had said. (This was about a month ago, and we were going through a period of every day over 100°.) After watching the boys really hustle to collect all the loose balls, and (still waiting for the water reward) watching them run 2 laps for being too slow, and then after the laps hearing the coach tell them they "had no future in life" I had enough. I got out of my truck to pull him from the camp.
But I was mild by comparison to the other dad. He confronted the coach and completely berated him in front of the kids, I mean he got in his face and just SCREAMED at him. Then he flipped the switch off and very calmly said, "Now how does it feel to be humiliated in public?" and collected his kid and left.
Denying kids water during a hot practice is ridiculous. Talk to other parents and get united, then talk calmly with the coach about what we know now in the 21st century.
__________________ "Reality TV is an oxymoron. Reality is all that stuff that happens when the TV is turned off." -- me, June 2004
I've coached Lacrosse for a number of years and handled teams from 3rd grade beginners all the way to high school teams. My policy has always been water every 15 mins when running practice if its really hot then more often . The break only needs to be 2 to 2.5 minutes for the youngest kids to about a minute for middle school and high school players. By placing a strict time limit it teaches the kids to get off the field get water and hustle back. If you have kids that are not hustling back they do push ups in front of the other kids. Normally it only takes one practice for the kids to hustle so no more push ups.
Welcome to FFCars! The
representations expressed are the representations and opinions of
the FFCars.com forum members and do not necessarily reflect the
opinions and viewpoints of the site owners, moderators, Factory Five
Racing, Inc. or Ford Motor Company. This website
has been planned and developed by FFCars.com and its forum members
and should not be construed as being endorsed by Factory Five
Racing, Inc. or Ford Motor Company for any
purpose. "FFR", "Factory Five", "Factory Five Racing", and the
Factory Five Racing logo are registered trademarks of Factory Five
Racing, Inc. FFCars.com forum members agree not to
post any copyrighted material unless the copyrighted material is
owned by you. Although we do not and cannot review the messages
posted and are not responsible for the content of any of these
messages, we reserve the right to delete any message for any reason
whatsoever. You remain solely responsible for the content of your
messages, and you agree to indemnify and hold us harmless with
respect to any claim based upon transmission of your message(s).
Thank you for visiting the FFCars.com Forum dedicated to Factory