Ok guys need some help. I live in the socialist state of NY and Just got off phone with New York State Department of Motor Vehicles Technical Services Bureau. I have sent in all my paperwork to them to set up inspection for my GTM to get my VIN #. All my paper work is good they said (Meaning all my parts checked out and nothing is stolen) BUT he said I must have bumpers on my car to pass inspection. OR a letter from Factory Five stating the frame behind the fiberglass is shock absorbing. Anyone else run into this; and what did you do. Anyone have any ideas? No way do I want to put external bumbers on this car.
Do a search on the other kits as well - they all have the same issue in NYS. Here is a somewhat recent discussion started on the coupe: NY Coupe Owners
I am not that familiar with the GTM internals but it looks like if you make a reasonable effort to comply with either an internal or external solution it will be acceptable. There are no specific performance requirements to be met which brings it down to an subjective visual evaluation. Take a look at what passes for a roadster bumper in NY and the improvisation of others here. Good luck!
Do a search on the other kits as well - they all have the same issue in NYS. Here is a somewhat recent discussion started on the coupe: NY Coupe Owners
I am not that familiar with the GTM internals but it looks like if you make a reasonable effort to comply with either an internal or external solution it will be acceptable. There are no specific performance requirements to be met which brings it down to an subjective visual evaluation. Take a look at what passes for a roadster bumper in NY and the improvisation of others here. Good luck!
Todd
Yeah, what about little bar bumpers like you see older VW Bug guys running? They pretty much weld or bolt a small vertical bar onto the existing bumper mount and it seems to, technically, pass the sniff test. I understand you don't want to put anything THROUGH the body, but maybe something that comes from underneath on the front and comes from the diffuser gap area in the rear? Sounds like it's really just a technical "hoop" they want you to jump through.
Maybe you could actually make something up that you could pass along to others in NYS so that THEY too can get their cars passed when the time comes. That would be cool, as once you get something approved, it would be pretty hard for the next guy to get any grief about the same setup.
S/B, if you received the home built vehicle information packet from NYSDMV, the fact that bumpers are needed should not be news. There are some minimum equipment requirements, like wipers, DOT lights, windshield glass, seatbelts, etc and includes bumpers of some sort . The pictures you sent in were intended to show proof of the minimum requirements. Also, you have not passed the stolen parts test until the state police inspection, which is different than the normal annual safety inspection. Your paperwork may show that you have receipts for all the major assemblies...the police will determine if any of it is suspected of being stolen. Their primary interest is determining basic structural integrity of the vehicle and looking for stolen parts.
What you would need to do is to devise some sort of bumperette, take pictures of them on the car and send them into Tom. After he approves of them, what you do with them is up to you. I doubt FFR is going to be willing to get into the fray with DMV.....they wouldn't lift a finger when the DOT numbers on the turn signal lenses failed the DMV's scrutiny a few years ago.
S/B Thanks for the heads up....
With my GTM going to the paint shop this month I'm very interested in what needs to be included to get the title. I know of one GTM that is registered in NY and he said nothing about bumpers. What he did say is he registered his as a salvaged vehicle. I built mine with all new parts so I can't go that route. If I hear more I'll keep you posted.
Steve
S/B Thanks for the heads up....
With my GTM going to the paint shop this month I'm very interested in what needs to be included to get the title. I know of one GTM that is registered in NY and he said nothing about bumpers. What he did say is he registered his as a salvaged vehicle. I built mine with all new parts so I can't go that route. If I hear more I'll keep you posted.
Steve
You really should call the DMV and get your kit car package, it has everything you need to fill out in there.
Registering as a salvage title makes absolutely no sense to me. He might have bought a salvaged Vette for a donor, but he would have still gone though the kit car application process to get a new VIN number assigned and a clear title for the GTM.
S/B Thanks for the heads up....
With my GTM going to the paint shop this month I'm very interested in what needs to be included to get the title. I know of one GTM that is registered in NY and he said nothing about bumpers. What he did say is he registered his as a salvaged vehicle. I built mine with all new parts so I can't go that route. If I hear more I'll keep you posted.
Steve
If he registered it as a salvaged vehicle, I assume with the original Vette titling, then his GTM must conform to all safety and emmisions requirements of the Vette. Not to mention the facts that the frame, body, and transmission VIN numbers are no longer in the vehicle. I think your "buddy" is asking for some serious troubles down the road. Certainly these would be issues if selling the vehicle, and if a subsequent owner were to be injured or killed in the vehicle, well, I think your buddy may have some esplanin to do! Not to mention the issues with insuring if the vehicle is looked at by the insurer.
The bumper thing should not be that big of a deal. Something that is temperarily bolted on to satisfy the rule should suffice. I would highly recommend AGAINST what your friend has done.
Crash..I agree 100%..This GTM owner is just a person I meet at the 2011 FFR open house, nice person but not really a buddy. Another issue people going the salvage route will have is when they go to sell the buyer will have a hard time getting a large dollar loan for a salvaged vehicle.
What if one were to create bars that ran across both front an back ends of the car with minimal clearance behind the body. Then mounting those to the frame using small gas bumper struts off some small production car. It would take a bit of fabricating but when someone looked at it you would have a bumper/shock absorber assembly mounted on the car. The bar and brackets could be aluminum.
I've spent the past several minutes scrolling though the assembly manual looking photos of the frame and photos that show how much clearance exists between the tip of the nose and the frame and the rear section below the license plate and the frame.
It doesn't have to be massive as the concept is for it to crumple and absorb the impact in a collision.
Maybe it's something that one of the GTM aftermarket folks can address.
Thanks guys for all the input. I did receive my kit car information packet from the NYSDMV months ago and saw the "BUMPERS" requirement; but just figured the bumpers are assumed internal like any modern day corvette, camaro, mustange or any other modern day production vehicle. I should have know better to assume with NYS???? I have a couple ideas and will let you know how I make out.
My suggestion is to take the fog lights out and fabricate a bracket for each side that holds a tube.
On the rear space out the license plate and mount another tube to that. Put some foam between the tube and the body (not touching) just in case they want to push on them a lot.
It would likely meet the requirement. Paint them flat black, pass and then do what you wish. My thought is the guy doing the inspection is not being a pain, just doing his job. Be nice to him and do your best to make an effort at bumpers and it may work out.
That being said Arrowhead got screwed by NYS and have to give up his motor for some clerical BS. HTH, Richard.
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