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Old 10-24-2013, 10:00 PM   #1 (permalink)
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427 street Oil cooler scoop question and more... test your knowledge!!!

Well, I have started assembly on my bride's MK4 and have come to the first crossroads in my plan. Im building it as a 427 street car, as opposed to my 427 s/c car, and thought I knew the characteristics of a street car... now im not too sure.

here is what i know...

street cars had:

no roll bar
overriders and nudge bars
undercar exhaust
no hood scoop
ash trays
street dash layout
round tail lights
fiberglass trunk floor
no oil cooler
small gas cap
underhood battery
Front grill splitter
Glove box

BUT... for some reason, I thought the early ones were built without an oil cooler scoop (kinda like the 289s). Am I right, or am i imagining this??? I want to get it right, but with as little "major" surgery as possible. I looked at all the pics I could find of the 427 street cars over the past week or so and now think Im imagining it. I thought that I remember reading that the early 427 street cars were scoopless to keep the scoop from catching when they entered steep driveways, and the race cars had scoops since this wasnt a problem.

Any thoughts???

Oh, and is there anything you can add to my street car list that im missing???

Thanks,

Bobby
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MK3 FFR5004, 427 FE, TKO-600, lots of csx parts, IRS W/3.73'S, Blue/White stripes, pin drive, Vintage wheels & GoodYears.

MK4 FFR7???, Bride's ride. street car, no bar or scoops, undercar exhaust, LS1 w 4l60e auto, ac, and all the comfy stuff

11 Vette GS ... daily driver
94 Vette Coupe 28k miles ... garage art
70 Vette Convertable ... 20 year resto project
57 Chevy Truck ... shop truck aka beater
69 Camaro Z28/RS 16k miles ... barn find

Last edited by bgbadaz; 10-24-2013 at 11:40 PM..
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Old 10-24-2013, 10:41 PM   #2 (permalink)
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From the pics I have of 427 street Cobras, the scoop is there but there is nothing in them. From the book The Complete Book of Shelby Automobiles by Colin Comer:
"The first batch of Street 427 cars were built using leftover Competition bodies from the initial stock of 100 cars intended for the FIA homologation requirement."
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Old 10-24-2013, 11:00 PM   #3 (permalink)
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hm... now im wondering if it was the opposite. maybe the later ones were like that due to damage suffered from the early ones. then again, maybe im dreaming the whole thing. anyone else???
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"Sweat The Details" a65SSnake

MK3 FFR5004, 427 FE, TKO-600, lots of csx parts, IRS W/3.73'S, Blue/White stripes, pin drive, Vintage wheels & GoodYears.

MK4 FFR7???, Bride's ride. street car, no bar or scoops, undercar exhaust, LS1 w 4l60e auto, ac, and all the comfy stuff

11 Vette GS ... daily driver
94 Vette Coupe 28k miles ... garage art
70 Vette Convertable ... 20 year resto project
57 Chevy Truck ... shop truck aka beater
69 Camaro Z28/RS 16k miles ... barn find
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Old 10-24-2013, 11:23 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Here's a website with a lot of pics of 427 cars. I found pics of street cars with oil coolers. Then again, I found street cars with pretty much all of the comp car parts.

CSX 3000 SERIES
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Old 10-24-2013, 11:41 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Thanks Glenn, it looks like the later cars (starting around 3280) are minus the oil cooler scoop, but I can't find a clear pic to tell for sure.
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"Sweat The Details" a65SSnake

MK3 FFR5004, 427 FE, TKO-600, lots of csx parts, IRS W/3.73'S, Blue/White stripes, pin drive, Vintage wheels & GoodYears.

MK4 FFR7???, Bride's ride. street car, no bar or scoops, undercar exhaust, LS1 w 4l60e auto, ac, and all the comfy stuff

11 Vette GS ... daily driver
94 Vette Coupe 28k miles ... garage art
70 Vette Convertable ... 20 year resto project
57 Chevy Truck ... shop truck aka beater
69 Camaro Z28/RS 16k miles ... barn find

Last edited by bgbadaz; 10-24-2013 at 11:48 PM..
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Old 10-25-2013, 02:01 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Colin is one of the best resources... here's his website: Collector Cars: Significant Muscle, Exotic, Sports and Historic Race Cars at Colin's Classic Auto

His book is awesome... if you don't have a copy, it's a definite must-have for everyone trying to build a more period-correct car.
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Old 10-25-2013, 03:20 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Build it however you want it. I'll bet however you want it, you'll be able to find an original CSX with your combo. As far as inspiration goes, CSX3305 will always be mine. An original with a SOHC in it, engine swap done back in the 70's I believe. Part of the problem with replicating an original is that they often were finished to however the owner wanted it or was later modified by the owner. This reminds me of the debate about the majority of Cobras having the quick jacks on backwards.

At the end of the day, do whatever you want / think looks best because that's exactly how things were done back then. I'd be surprised if you could find two original Cobras that are identical in every way.
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Last edited by Motorhead; 10-25-2013 at 03:26 AM..
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Old 10-26-2013, 01:17 AM   #8 (permalink)
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I have seen a picture of a Kirkham 427 Street Roadster w/o an oil cooler intake but I have not stumbled on to a picture of an original in that configuration. I'm very doubtful that any originals were actually fabricated that way. If so, it could not have been more than a very, very few.

Depending on the variation of street car you are building - the early ones had rectangular tail lights. Late versions (66 and 67 typically) switched to round ones.

427 Street Cars had aluminum trunk side/bottom panels.

And there was a cigarette lighter in the dash to go with the ash tray. Many other characteristics too - Trico washer bottle, vinyl-covered rear bulkhead behind the seats, vinyl pocket on the rear bulkhead to store the side curtains in, pockets in the doors, all screws were straight blade (no phillips head), 7-inch wheels all around (often changed later), different rear fender flare configurations, etc. It can drive one nuts.

Here is the link to the Kirkham photo gallery showing the street car minus the oil cooler intake.

http://www.kirkhammotorsports.com/ga...reetgal#g_11_0

Last edited by Fastcars; 10-26-2013 at 01:21 AM.. Reason: Add photo link
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Old 10-26-2013, 01:31 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Some of the street cars even had a stereo system. I'm not sure if I'll be able to find it but I remember finding an old black and white pic of a Cobra that had a stereo unit placed under the dash.
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"It's loud, smells like gasoline, and shakes, shudders, and bucks. It makes your arms tired and your feet hot. You nearly crash about once every ten minutes. It's so damn wonderful you canít believe it." -Automobile Mag. Oct. '04

"AC Cobra - America's sensational GT car." - Road & Track Road Test Annual '64

Last edited by Motorhead; 10-26-2013 at 01:38 AM..
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Old 10-26-2013, 11:34 AM   #10 (permalink)
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I don't know about stereo (kind of doubt it) but I understand most radio equipped Cobras had a dealer installed AM Motorola unit mounted in a panel between the dash cowl support bars.
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Old 10-26-2013, 02:59 PM   #11 (permalink)
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See, Im kinda on the fence about this. I want a period looking street car for the wife, but its not gonna be 100%, of even 75%for that matter(hell, im putting an ls1/auto in it). Im not even sure if the work to emove the scoop is worth the reward, because im not too sure if I like it or not. After looking at alot of pics, it seems like the very late cars (csx3280 and up) were scoopless, so you are right, it was only a handful that were built without it. I guess my problem is this... I want to build a street car that looks like a street car, not one that looks like it was a kit converted to a street car. Im almost considering a 289 body right now... Ugh, decisions.

The problem i have run into in rsearching cars is exactly what Motorhead said, alot of people took their street cars and added s/c stuff to them (pipes, roll bar, hood scoop) so its hard to find pics of a "true" street car now. 289s are a little different, those didnt get changed as much it seems.

thanks guys,
Bobby
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"Sweat The Details" a65SSnake

MK3 FFR5004, 427 FE, TKO-600, lots of csx parts, IRS W/3.73'S, Blue/White stripes, pin drive, Vintage wheels & GoodYears.

MK4 FFR7???, Bride's ride. street car, no bar or scoops, undercar exhaust, LS1 w 4l60e auto, ac, and all the comfy stuff

11 Vette GS ... daily driver
94 Vette Coupe 28k miles ... garage art
70 Vette Convertable ... 20 year resto project
57 Chevy Truck ... shop truck aka beater
69 Camaro Z28/RS 16k miles ... barn find
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Old 10-26-2013, 03:27 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bgbadaz View Post
I want to build a street car that looks like a street car, not one that looks like it was a kit converted to a street car. Im almost considering a 289 body right now... Ugh, decisions.
Hard to beat a street 289 Bobby!

Bruce has the body. Now look at this picture....


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Old 10-26-2013, 03:50 PM   #13 (permalink)
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I have personally seen two original street cars that had the oil cooler scoop but no oil cooler. One at Barnett Jackson and one at a car show. I have read and seen pictures of both with and without. From what I understand there where both made and I have read that with serial number ranges but don't remember where. I am keeping the scoop but without cooler for my street 427. I think with the full bumper it's not that noticeable and for me not worth the effort. Besides it could be original.

I do like the look with the scoop removed and think it looks smoother, more street. My vote would be go for the 289 body.
Rod
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Old 10-26-2013, 07:09 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Here are some pictures of 427 street cars to study.

1967 Shelby Cobra 427

CSX 3360 At Palo Alto Concours 2011 - Club Cobra

1966 Used Shelby Cobra 427 at Canepa Serving Scotts Valley, IID 6863033

Sports Car Graphic, November 1965, Double Cobra test

1965 Shelby 427 Cobra CSX3134 at Colin's Classic Auto

It's difficult to build a street roadster replica other than through Kirkham or maybe the Shelby continuation cars. Most bodies are pulled from molds that are based on the SC and Competition bodies with the wide hips and flares. The street roadsters had, I believe, 3 different style of rear fenders - original wide hip without flare, narrow hip w/o flare, and I believe a few that were flared pretty much like the SC cars. I'm building my roadster off of an ERA replica because they gave me something close to a street roadster as an option.
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Old 10-27-2013, 05:36 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Just happen to see this in another thread...


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